From mriddle at oasis.novia.net Fri Apr 1 07:46:00 2005 From: mriddle at oasis.novia.net (Mike Riddle) Date: Fri Apr 1 07:46:37 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] The Soul of a Controversy Message-ID: <200504011246.j31Ck17t027552@oasis.novia.net> http://www.opinionjournal.com/taste/?id=110006500 The Soul of a Controversy After Terri Schiavo's death, questions remain. BY DAVID B. HART Friday, April 1, 2005 12:01 a.m. Terri Schiavo has now died, but of course the controversy surrounding her last days will persist indefinitely. Most of the issues raised as she was dying were legal and moral; but at the margins of the storm, questions of a more "metaphysical" nature were occasionally raised in public. For instance, I heard three people on the radio last week speculating on the whereabouts of her "soul." One opined that where consciousness has sunk below a certain minimally responsive level, the soul has already departed the body; the other two thought that the soul remains, but as a dormant prisoner of the ruined flesh, awaiting release. Their arguments, being intuitive, were of little interest. What caught my attention was the unreflective dualism to which all three clearly subscribed: The soul, they assumed, is a kind of magical essence haunting the body, a ghost in a machine. This is in fact a peculiarly modern view of the matter, not much older than the 17th-century philosophy of Descartes. While it is now the model to which most of us habitually revert when talking about the soul--whether we believe in such things or not--it has scant basis in either Christian or Jewish tradition. The "living soul" of Scripture is the whole corporeal and spiritual totality of a person whom the breath of God has wakened to life. Thomas Aquinas, interpreting centuries of Christian and pagan metaphysics, defined the immortal soul as the "form of the body," the vital power animating, pervading, shaping an individual from the moment of conception, drawing all the energies of life into a unity. This is not to deny that, for Christian tradition, the soul transcends and survives the earthly life of the body. It is only to say that the soul, rather than being a kind of "guest" within the self, is instead the underlying mystery of a life in its fullness. In it the multiplicity of experience is knit into a single continuous and developing identity. It encompasses all the dimensions of human existence: animal functions and abstract intellect, sensation and reason, emotion and reflection, flesh and spirit, natural aptitude and supernatural longing. As such, it grants us an openness to the world of which no other creature is capable, allowing us to take in reality through feeling and thought, recognition and surprise, will and desire, memory and anticipation, imagination and curiosity, delight and sorrow, invention and art. The fourth-century theologian Gregory of Nyssa calls the soul a "living mirror" in which all things shine, so immense in its capacity that it can, when turned toward the light of God, grow eternally in an ever greater embrace of divine beauty. For the seventh-century theologian Maximus the Confessor, the human soul is the "boundary" between material and spiritual reality--heaven and earth--and so constitutes a microcosm that joins together, in itself, all the spheres of being. I doubt even the dogmatic materialists among us are wholly insensible to the miraculous oddity that in the midst of organic nature there exists a creature so exorbitantly in excess of what material causality could possibly adumbrate, a living mirror where all splendors gather, an animal who is also a creative and interpretive being with a longing for eternity. Whether one is willing to speak of a "rational soul" or not, there is obviously an irreducible mystery here, one that commands our reverence. Granted, it is easiest to sense this mystery when gazing at the Sistine Chapel's ceiling or listening to Bach. But it should be evident--for Christians at least--even when everything glorious and prodigious in our nature has been stripped away and all that remains is frailty, brokenness and dependency, or when a person we love has been largely lost to us in the labyrinth of a damaged brain. Even among such ravages--for those with the eyes to see it--a terrible dignity still shines out. I do not understand exactly why those who wanted Terri Schiavo to die had become so resolute in their purposes by the end. If she was as "vegetative" as they believed, what harm would it have done, I wonder, to surrender her to the charity (however fruitless) of her parents? Of this I am certain, though: Christians who understand their faith are obliged to believe that she was, to the last, a living soul. It is true that, in some real sense, it was her soul that those who loved her could no longer reach, but it was also her soul that they touched with their hands and spoke to and grieved over and adored. And this also means that it was a living soul that we as a society chose to abandon to starvation and thirst--which should, at the very least, give us cause to consider what else we may have abandoned along the way. Mr. Hart, an Eastern Orthodox theologian, is the author of "The Beauty of the Infinite" (Eerdmans). From mriddle at papillion.ne.us Fri Apr 1 12:57:04 2005 From: mriddle at papillion.ne.us (Mike Riddle) Date: Fri Apr 1 12:57:25 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Missle guidance Systems Message-ID: <20050401175704.GPWJ11124.lakermmtao04.cox.net@enigmaster> ==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== Have you ever wondered about how a missle is guided from where it is to where you want it to be? Here is a VERY succinct explanation of missle technology. I know you will love it http://dnld.seakew.com/missile%20guidance%20explained.wav ===================END FORWARDED MESSAGE=================== From rluchor at yahoo.com Fri Apr 1 13:58:33 2005 From: rluchor at yahoo.com (Rich Luchor) Date: Fri Apr 1 13:59:34 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Re: Missle guidance Systems In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050401185833.50486.qmail@web31513.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Excellent! Answered all of my questions. --- Mike Riddle wrote: > ==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== > > > Have you ever wondered about how a missle is guided from where it is to > where you want it to be? Here is a VERY succinct explanation of missle > technology. I know you will love it > > http://dnld.seakew.com/missile%20guidance%20explained.wav > > > ===================END FORWARDED MESSAGE=================== > > > > _______________________________________________ > os2-right-stuff-l mailing list > os2-right-stuff-l@jtan.com > http://mailman.jtan.com/mailman/listinfo/os2-right-stuff-l > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From prather.js at verizon.net Fri Apr 1 14:11:50 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Fri Apr 1 14:12:27 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Missle guidance Systems In-Reply-To: <20050401175704.GPWJ11124.lakermmtao04.cox.net@enigmaster> Message-ID: <0IEA00LWG7ZR81R0@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> On Fri, 01 Apr 2005 11:57:04 -0600, Mike Riddle wrote: >Have you ever wondered about how a missle is guided from where it is to >where you want it to be? Here is a VERY succinct explanation of missle >technology. The VOICE! Where did they find the very guy who narrated all those training films I saw in the navy to do this!!! Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Fri Apr 1 20:49:09 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Fri Apr 1 20:49:32 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Can you say, "Nine point three?" Message-ID: <424DFA15.3000902@bernstein.providence.ri.us> In the current issue of _Nature_ are several discussions of last December's "big" earthquake. How "big" you ask? "Stein and Okal (page 581) argue that early estimates of the magnitude were far too low. Using extremely long-period seismic 'normal mode' waves, they calculate that the earthquake's magnitude was 9.3, about three times larger than initial estimates of 9.0 (given the logarithmic nature of earthquake-magnitude scales)." http://www.nature.com/cgi-taf/DynaPage.taf?file=/nature/journal/v434/n7033/full/434573a_fs.html -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From prather.js at verizon.net Fri Apr 1 21:30:08 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Fri Apr 1 21:30:33 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Can you say, "Nine point three?" In-Reply-To: <424DFA15.3000902@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <0IEA00CAOSA9ZUV2@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> On Fri, 01 Apr 2005 20:49:09 -0500, Bob Bernstein wrote: >In the current issue of _Nature_ are several discussions of last >December's "big" earthquake. How "big" you ask? Having lived in Northern California and then in the Kanto Plains area of Japan gives new meaning to "Rock Around the Clock". Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Fri Apr 1 22:55:46 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Fri Apr 1 23:12:41 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Can you say, "Nine point three?" In-Reply-To: <0IEA00CAOSA9ZUV2@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0IEA00CAOSA9ZUV2@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <424E17C2.7000704@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Jerry Prather wrote: > Having lived in Northern California and then in the Kanto Plains > area of Japan gives new meaning to "Rock Around the Clock". NPR this afternoon interviewed a Caltech geology prof, one of the authors published in this number of _Nature_. He brought out that the Dec.04 quake holds the (modern) record for being the -=longest=- quake ever observed: ten minutes. The "record" that REALLY impresses me is the one mentioned in a Nova episode being rerun this week on PBS -- subject: Krakatoa. The final eruption produced the loudest sound ever on the face of the earth: it was heard in Perth, Australia!!! -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From sjkleinsr at cox.net Sat Apr 2 11:10:47 2005 From: sjkleinsr at cox.net (Stan Klein, Sr.) Date: Sat Apr 2 11:11:51 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Good Short Story Message-ID: <20050402161047.CWMN19214.lakermmtao07.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> Good short story A college class was told they had to write a short story in as few words as possible. The story must contain the following three components: (1) Religion (2) Sexuality (3) Mystery There was only one A+ paper in the entire class. This is the A+ story. Short story Good God ! I'm pregnant. I wonder which one of those jerks is the dad. Stan Klein, Sr. Being rich is having money; being wealthy is having time. From dep at linuxandmain.com Sun Apr 3 09:37:06 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Sun Apr 3 09:35:21 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] steyn, great as usual Message-ID: <200504030937.06412.dep@linuxandmain.com> http://www.suntimes.com/output/steyn/cst-edt-steyn03.html GOP crack-up? Pardon my guffaw April 3, 2005 BY MARK STEYN SUN-TIMES COLUMNIST Anyone would think it was the Republicans who'd lost the 2004 elections, and the 2002 elections, and the 2000 elections. From every corner, concerned "friends" of the party rise to offer "friendly" advice. Norman Lear, who produced all those critically acclaimed issue-confronting heroine-gets-an-abortion '70s sitcoms that seem a lot more dated than ''The Beverly Hillbillies'' these days, has now produced a People For the American Way ad in which a man who identifies himself as a "common sense Republican" objects to any attempt to end the Democratic filibuster of Bush's judicial nominees. As things turn out, the "common sense Republican" has so much common sense he's an official with a union that endorsed John Kerry. Then there's the 59 striped-pants colossi of the Nixon-Ford-Reagan State Department who've sent a letter to the Senate calling on them to reject John Bolton's nomination as U.N. ambassador. According to the Associated Press report, the signatories include: "Princeton Lyman, ambassador to South Africa and Nigeria under Presidents Reagan, George H.W. Bush and Bill Clinton; Monteagle Stearns, ambassador to Greece and Ivory Coast in the Ford, Carter and Reagan administrations; and Spurgeon Keeny Jr., deputy director of the Arms Control Agency in the Carter administration." Princeton Lyman? Monteagle Stearns? Spurgeon Keeny Jr.? If Norman Lear's shows had wacky characters like that, they'd still be in syndication. It's a good rule of thumb that anything 59 economists, bureaucrats or diplomats are prepared to sign an open letter objecting to is by definition a good thing. But that goes double when the 59 panjandrums lined up against you are Princeton Monteagle Jr., President Nixon's ambassador to the Spurgeon Islands; Spurgeon Monkfish III, President Ford's ambassador to the Lyman Islands; Dartmouth Monticello IV, President Johnson's personal emissary to His Serene Highness the Monteagle of Keeny; Columbia Long-Playing-Album, the first diplomat to be named by President Carter to the State Department's Name Control Agency; and Vasser Peachy-Keeny, the first woman to be named Vasser Peachy-Keeny. One sees their point, of course: Let a fellow called "John" Bolton become ambassador and next thing you know Earl and Bud will want the gig. Even Sen. John Danforth, who should know better, got in on the act, taking half a page in the New York Times to give the Full Monteagle to the "religious right." Blog maestro Andrew Sullivan decided that America was witnessing a "conservative crack-up" over Terri Schiavo and the embrace of her cause by extreme right wing fundamentalist theocrat zealots like, er, Jesse Jackson and Ralph Nader. Sullivan was last predicting a "conservative crack-up" during the impeachment era, on the grounds (if I recall correctly) that Republican moralizing would dramatically cut into Strom Thurmond's share of the gay vote. In the '90s, the Weekly Standard ran innumerable special editions devoted to the subject: Conservative Crack-Up; Conservative Crack-Up 2; Conservative Crack-Up -- The Musical; Abbott And Costello Meet The Conservative Crack-Up; Conservative Crack-Up On Elm Street; Four Weddings And A Conservative Crack-Up; Rod Stewart Sings Timeless Favorites From The Great Conservative Crack-Up, etc. The point to bear in mind when Hollywood producers, State Department diplomats, respected senators, gay mavericks, the New York Times and the rest of the media offer conservatives advice is a simple one: As that great self-esteem volume has it, He's Really Not That Into You. The preferred media Republican is an amiable loser: the ne plus ultra of GOP candidates was the late Fred Tuttle, the lame, wizened idiot dairy farmer put up for a joke against Sen. Patrick Leahy in Vermont. But, if they can't get that lucky, the media will gladly take a Bob Dole type, a decent old no-hoper who goes down to predictable defeat and gets rave reviews for being such a good loser. Republicans could well run into trouble in 2006 and 2008, but for being insufficiently conservative on things like immigration rather than for anything the media claim they're cracking up over. The notion, for example, that poor Terri Schiavo will cost Republicans votes in a year and a half's time is ludicrous. The best distillation of the pro-Schiavo case was made by James Lileks, the bard of Minnesota, responding to the provocateur Christopher Hitchens' dismissal of her as a "non-human entity." "It is not wise," wrote Lileks, "to call people dead before they are actually, well, dead. You can be 'as good as dead' or 'brain dead' or 'close to death,' but if the heart beats and the chest rises, I think we should balk at saying this constitutes dead, period." Just so. Once you get used to designating living, breathing bodies as "non-human entities," it's easy to bandy them ever more carelessly -- as they do in the eminently progressive Netherlands, where their relaxed attitude to pot and prostitution led to a relaxed attitude to euthanasia which looks like relaxing the Dutch people right out of business. It's all done quietly over there -- no fuss, no publicity; you go in to hospital with a heavy cold and you're carried out by the handles. (By "handles," I mean a coffin, not a ceremonial phalanx of Monteagles and Princetons.) But that's not the American way. This is a legalistic society, where grade schools can't have kids knocking a ball around without getting a gazillion dollars worth of liability insurance. I was in Price Chopper the other day and they had a little basket of Easter samples on display accompanied by a page of full print outlining the various sub-clauses of the company's "tasting policy." That's America. In Holland, you can taste a cookie without signing a legal waiver, and, if you get food poisoning from it, the doctor will discreetly euthanize you to avoid putting your family through the trauma of waiting six hours for the stomach pump to become available. That's not how the American cookie crumbles. Euthanasia here will be a 10-year court culminating in slow-motion public execution played out on the 24-hour cable channels. The Republicans did the right thing here, and they won't be punished for it by the electors. As with abortion, this will be an issue where the public moves slowly but steadily toward the conservative position: Terri Schiavo's court-ordered death will not be without meaning. As to "crack-ups," that's only a neurotic way of saying that these days most of the intellectual debate is within the right. If, like the Democrats, all you've got are lockstep litmus tests on race and abortion and all the rest, what's to crack up over? You just lose elections every two years, but carry on insisting, as Ted Kennedy does, that you're still the majority party. Ted's quite a large majority just by himself these days, but it's still not enough. -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From mriddle at papillion.ne.us Sun Apr 3 12:38:08 2005 From: mriddle at papillion.ne.us (Mike Riddle) Date: Sun Apr 3 12:39:11 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Conclusion of today's George Will Column Message-ID: <20050403163807.GTZY2673.lakermmtao03.cox.net@enigmaster> http://www.townhall.com/columnists/georgewill/printgw20050403.shtml * * * Secular Europe is, however, wiser because of a man who worked at an altar. Europeans have been plied and belabored by various historicisms purporting to show that individuals are nullities governed by vast impersonal forces. Beginning in 1978, Europeans saw one man seize history by the lapels and shake it. One of G.K. Chesterton's Father Brown detective stories includes this passage: ``'I'm afraid I'm a practical man,' said the doctor with gruff humor, 'and I don't bother much about religion and philosophy.' 'You'll never be a practical man till you do,' said Father Brown.'' A poet made the same point: ``A flame rescued from dry wood has no weight in its luminous flight yet lifts the heavy lid of night.'' The poet became John Paul II. From m.o.davis at gte.net Sun Apr 3 17:32:12 2005 From: m.o.davis at gte.net (Davis Mark) Date: Sun Apr 3 17:50:06 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Unusual charity Message-ID: While shopping for guitar parts today I came across this unusual charity: http://guitarelectronics.zoovy.com/c=ufqgm9Ol62a6ykQUXTBMepYIZ/product/ BEER -- Mark Davis San Angelo, TX From dep at linuxandmain.com Sun Apr 3 19:33:59 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Sun Apr 3 19:32:14 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Unusual charity In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200504031933.59264.dep@linuxandmain.com> quoth Davis Mark: | While shopping for guitar parts today you'll be amused to know that stewart-macdonald is located here in athens, as is the luthier dan erlewine. (indeed, i know one of his assistants slightly. very nice young woman who i just realized i was supposed to phone last week. they may be going over my gibson tenor, which i may actually end up playing amid real musicians before the summer is over.) -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From m.o.davis at gte.net Sun Apr 3 23:06:42 2005 From: m.o.davis at gte.net (Davis Mark) Date: Sun Apr 3 23:07:18 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Unusual charity In-Reply-To: <200504031933.59264.dep@linuxandmain.com> References: <200504031933.59264.dep@linuxandmain.com> Message-ID: On Apr 3, 2005, at 6:33 PM, dep wrote: > you'll be amused to know that stewart-macdonald is located here in > athens, as is the luthier dan erlewine. Makes me want to be there. -- Mark Davis San Angelo, TX From mriddle at papillion.ne.us Mon Apr 4 17:23:58 2005 From: mriddle at papillion.ne.us (Mike Riddle) Date: Mon Apr 4 17:24:37 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Hilary for President Message-ID: <20050404212355.VYB2476.lakermmtao12.cox.net@enigmaster> ==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== Check this one out if you haven't seen it already http://i.euniverse.com/funpages/cms_content/6660/2008cc1.swf ===================END FORWARDED MESSAGE=================== From dep at linuxandmain.com Mon Apr 4 17:39:39 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Mon Apr 4 17:37:37 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Hilary for President In-Reply-To: <20050404212355.VYB2476.lakermmtao12.cox.net@enigmaster> References: <20050404212355.VYB2476.lakermmtao12.cox.net@enigmaster> Message-ID: <200504041739.39428.dep@linuxandmain.com> quoth Mike Riddle: | Check this one out if you haven't seen it already | | http://i.euniverse.com/funpages/cms_content/6660/2008cc1.swf but hillary! is, at least technically, a mwf. -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From sjkleinsr at cox.net Tue Apr 5 21:48:34 2005 From: sjkleinsr at cox.net (Stan Klein, Sr.) Date: Tue Apr 5 21:56:46 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] [Fwd: Monday's Test] Message-ID: <20050406014833.WMND28448.lakermmtao09.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> This does take some thought. Stan Klein, Sr. Being rich is having money; being wealthy is having time. -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: "Mawk and Deb Jasnoch" Subject: Fw: Monday's Test Date: Mon, 4 Apr 2005 20:25:51 -0600 (Mountain Daylight Time) Size: 5925 Url: http://mailman.jtan.com/pipermail/os2-right-stuff-l/attachments/20050405/5308345c/attachment.eml From m.o.davis at gte.net Tue Apr 5 21:33:59 2005 From: m.o.davis at gte.net (Davis Mark) Date: Tue Apr 5 23:08:08 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Selling one of my babies Message-ID: <50d42483a2e43f91f6c2d4f70d4a9cbc@gte.net> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ViewItem&item=7313532924&ssPageName=ADME:B:LC:US:1 -- Mark Davis San Angelo, TX From mriddle at oasis.novia.net Wed Apr 6 13:04:02 2005 From: mriddle at oasis.novia.net (Mike Riddle) Date: Wed Apr 6 13:40:13 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Fw: Printer jamed? Message-ID: <200504061704.j36H49Ja025940@oasis.novia.net> ==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== Fix the printer jam please? He's not dead but he's sure stuck. They do end up getting him out and letting him loose for those of you that are mouse lovers. How'd you like to get to work and find this problem? ===================END FORWARDED MESSAGE=================== -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: image/jpeg Size: 41499 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.jtan.com/pipermail/os2-right-stuff-l/attachments/20050406/d7db7f05/attachment-0003.jpg -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: image/jpeg Size: 48275 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.jtan.com/pipermail/os2-right-stuff-l/attachments/20050406/d7db7f05/attachment-0004.jpg -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: image/jpeg Size: 46824 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.jtan.com/pipermail/os2-right-stuff-l/attachments/20050406/d7db7f05/attachment-0005.jpg From rluchor at yahoo.com Wed Apr 6 17:33:12 2005 From: rluchor at yahoo.com (Rich Luchor) Date: Wed Apr 6 17:34:32 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Lock and Load! Message-ID: <20050406213312.26635.qmail@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Florida eyes allowing residents to open fire whenever they see threat U.S. National - AFP MIAMI (AFP) - Florida's legislature has approved a bill that would give residents the right to open fire against anyone they perceive as a threat in public, instead of having to try to avoid a conflict as under prevailing law. Outraged opponents say the law will encourage Floridians to open fire first and ask questions later, fostering a sort of statewide Wild West shootout mentality. Supporters argue that criminals will think twice if they believe they are likely to be promptly shot when they assault someone. Republican Governor Jeb Bush, who has said he plans to sign the bill, says it is "a good, commonsense, anti-crime issue." Current state law allows residents to "shoot to kill if their property, such as their home or car, is invaded by an unknown assailant." But it also states that if a resident is confronted or threatened in a public place, he or she must first try to avoid the confrontation or flee before taking any violent step in self defense against an assailant. The bill, supported by the influential National Rifle Association, was approved by both houses of the Republican-run legislature on Tuesday. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Personals - Better first dates. More second dates. http://personals.yahoo.com From prather.js at verizon.net Wed Apr 6 18:32:47 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Wed Apr 6 18:33:36 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Lock and Load! In-Reply-To: <20050406213312.26635.qmail@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <0IEJ004L8QMN2DF6@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> On Wed, 06 Apr 2005 14:33:12 -0700 (PDT), Rich Luchor wrote: >But it also states that if a resident is confronted or threatened in a public >place, he or she must first try to avoid the confrontation or flee before >taking any violent step in self defense against an assailant. That's not what the judge said on John Gibson's show this evening. He specifically said that it was not going to be like New Jersey where you have to shout "leave the premises" and run to the bedroom before you can use a weapon. Clarification??? Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From mriddle at oasis.novia.net Wed Apr 6 20:44:32 2005 From: mriddle at oasis.novia.net (Mike Riddle) Date: Wed Apr 6 20:45:42 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Lock and Load! In-Reply-To: <0IEJ004L8QMN2DF6@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <200504070044.j370iWmC013211@oasis.novia.net> On Wed, 06 Apr 2005 18:32:47 -0400 (EDT), Jerry Prather wrote: >>But it also states that if a resident is confronted or threatened in a public >>place, he or she must first try to avoid the confrontation or flee before >>taking any violent step in self defense against an assailant. Current state law. >That's not what the judge said on John Gibson's show this >evening. He specifically said that it was not going to be like >New Jersey where you have to shout "leave the premises" and run >to the bedroom before you can use a weapon. Florida already has a form of "make my day" law when you're at home, the new one extends it to in public. No more duty to retreat before assisting yourself or others. (If the reports I've read are accurate. Don't trust the mainstream media on this!) -- Michael H. Riddle http://www.papillion.ne.us/~mriddle/ Attorney at Law mriddle@monarch.papillion.ne.us The above isn't legal advice or opinion. If it were, it would be accompanied by an invoice. Do not rely on it. It may be forged. From mriddle at oasis.novia.net Wed Apr 6 20:48:54 2005 From: mriddle at oasis.novia.net (Mike Riddle) Date: Wed Apr 6 20:49:32 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Lock and Load! Message-ID: <200504070048.j370mt2Q015567@oasis.novia.net> On Wed, 06 Apr 2005 19:44:32 -0500, Mike Riddle wrote: >Florida already has a form of "make my day" law when you're at home, the new one >extends it to in public. No more duty to retreat before assisting yourself or >others. >(If the reports I've read are accurate. Don't trust the mainstream media on >this!) http://www.tallahassee.com/mld/tallahassee/news/11320274.htm From prather.js at verizon.net Wed Apr 6 20:52:13 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Wed Apr 6 21:04:32 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Lock and Load! In-Reply-To: <200504070048.j370mt2Q015567@oasis.novia.net> Message-ID: <0IEJ0016ZX310FB6@vms048.mailsrvcs.net> On Wed, 06 Apr 2005 19:48:54 -0500, Mike Riddle wrote: >http://www.tallahassee.com/mld/tallahassee/news/11320274.htm Yep! That's what I thought that John Gibson was saying. And usually I don't believe what the Tallahassee Democrat says, because it is what it's title says. (My sister worked for it for awhile.) Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From operagost at operagost.com Wed Apr 6 21:19:41 2005 From: operagost at operagost.com (Stephen Eickhoff) Date: Wed Apr 6 21:20:33 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Re: os2-right-stuff-l Digest, Vol 14, Issue 7 In-Reply-To: <200504061740.j36HeFR7030566@carme.jtan.com> References: <200504061740.j36HeFR7030566@carme.jtan.com> Message-ID: <42548AAD.5080709@operagost.com> os2-right-stuff-l-request@jtan.com wrote: > Send os2-right-stuff-l mailing list submissions to > os2-right-stuff-l@jtan.com > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://mailman.jtan.com/mailman/listinfo/os2-right-stuff-l > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > os2-right-stuff-l-request@jtan.com > > You can reach the person managing the list at > os2-right-stuff-l-owner@jtan.com > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of os2-right-stuff-l digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Fwd: Fw: Printer jamed? (Mike Riddle) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 12:04:02 -0500 > From: "Mike Riddle" > Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Fw: Printer jamed? > To: " os2-right-stuff-l" > Message-ID: <200504061704.j36H49Ja025940@oasis.novia.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > ==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== > > > > Fix the printer jam please? > > He's not dead but he's sure stuck. They do end up getting him out and > letting him loose for those of you that are mouse lovers. How'd you > like to get to work and find this problem? I'd probably jump first when I see the mouse, and then fall over when he starts moving! This is why you don't leave any slot covers missing from your PC, by the way. I have no idea how he managed to wiggle into a printer, however. Someone must have left a paper tray open. -- ---------------------------------- Stephen Eickhoff www.operagost.com "No one lights a lamp and puts it in a place where it will be hidden, or under a bowl. Instead he puts it on its stand, so that those who come in may see the light." Luke 11:33 ---------------------------------- From dep at linuxandmain.com Wed Apr 6 21:26:46 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Wed Apr 6 21:25:33 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Lock and Load! In-Reply-To: <200504070044.j370iWmC013211@oasis.novia.net> References: <200504070044.j370iWmC013211@oasis.novia.net> Message-ID: <200504062126.46839.dep@linuxandmain.com> quoth Mike Riddle: | Florida already has a form of "make my day" law when you're at home, | the new one extends it to in public. No more duty to retreat before | assisting yourself or others. florida also has a fleeing felon law. and when we were teachinf home defense at the sunrise, florida, p.d. -- this was nearly 30 years ago, i'm sorry to remember -- we taught people, usually women, to announce loudly that the bad guy was go back up and exit whence he came. and if he did *anything* other than that, the student was to empty the weapon into the bad guy. and we flat-out said that this was so that later, when questioned, the shooter upon being asked how many shots were fired, could reply, "i don't know, i just shot until it wouldn't shoot anymore." an important point in the "reasonable man" standard of perceived threat. and, again, this was a course taught by the police. my involvement was, um, an anamoly. -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From dep at linuxandmain.com Wed Apr 6 21:38:54 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Wed Apr 6 21:36:39 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Selling one of my babies In-Reply-To: <50d42483a2e43f91f6c2d4f70d4a9cbc@gte.net> References: <50d42483a2e43f91f6c2d4f70d4a9cbc@gte.net> Message-ID: <200504062138.55061.dep@linuxandmain.com> quoth Davis Mark: | http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? | ViewItem&item=7313532924&ssPageName=ADME:B:LC:US:1 gorgeous guitar, but it points in the wrong direction and has two too many strings. (i get to be so bold because of an amusing circumstance which has arisen here. i am near, and in a way moved here because of, fur peace ranch [it's a long story]. it is owned and run by jorma kaukonen, guitarist of jefferson airplane and hot tuna, and his wife, vanessa. at dinner 10 days ago, upon hearing that i play [with] tenor guitar, vanessa mentioned that barry mitterhoff, the great mandolinist and better'n middlin banjo player, has become enamored of the tenor, so i need to bring mine down to the ranch when tuna's in town. which has led to notions of the first ever tenor guitar duet, made all the more interesting in that they would point in opposite directions, in that barry is right-handed. i haven't the foggiest notion whether anything at all will come of this or even if i am a good, fair, poor, or really lousy tenor player, in that i have just fiddled around with one for a bunch of years and have no idea as to how it is supposed to be played. but i'm grabbing the extremely rare opportunity to be a tenor guitar chauvinist. the opportunity will certainly never pass this way again.) -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From mriddle at oasis.novia.net Wed Apr 6 22:05:15 2005 From: mriddle at oasis.novia.net (Mike Riddle) Date: Wed Apr 6 22:06:33 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Foam In-Reply-To: <200504062138.55061.dep@linuxandmain.com> Message-ID: <200504070205.j3725FGo022000@oasis.novia.net> So, Shuttle Guy, what's with the foam on the fuel tank? Wasn't that why we had this downtime, so we could fix it? Did NASA hire Tim from Tool Time? ;-) "enquiring minds want to know" From m.o.davis at gte.net Thu Apr 7 18:04:39 2005 From: m.o.davis at gte.net (Davis Mark) Date: Thu Apr 7 18:05:58 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] "New" guitar Message-ID: <70b3c04c0ec11dee1a541dd72163b187@gte.net> http://home1.gte.net/res006gg/html/mark/guitar4.html The one on the left. -- Mark Davis San Angelo, TX From prather.js at verizon.net Thu Apr 7 19:13:19 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Thu Apr 7 19:13:53 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] "New" guitar Message-ID: <0IEL00FXSN689ENB@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> On Thu, 07 Apr 2005 17:04:39 -0500, Davis Mark wrote: >http://home1.gte.net/res006gg/html/mark/guitar4.html Are headless guitars played by unthinking people??? Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From mriddle at monarch.papillion.ne.us Fri Apr 8 17:15:43 2005 From: mriddle at monarch.papillion.ne.us (Mike Riddle) Date: Fri Apr 8 17:16:20 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Thirty cute lines Message-ID: <20050408211543.ZMBF6521.lakermmtao02.cox.net@enigmaster> ==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== THIRTY LINES TO MAKE YOU SMILE 1. My husband and I divorced over religious differences. He thought he was God and I didn't. 2. I don't suffer from insanity; I enjoy every minute of it. 3. I Work Hard Because Millions On Welfare Depend on Me! 4. Some people are alive only because it's illegal to kill them. 5. I used to have a handle on life, but it broke. 6. Don't take life too seriously; No one gets out alive. 7. You're just jealous because the voices only talk to me 8. Beauty is in the eye of the beer holder. 9. Earth is the insane asylum for the universe. 10. I'm not a complete idiot -- Some parts are missing. 11. Out of my mind. Back in five minutes. 12. NyQuil, the stuffy, sneezy, why-the-heck-is-the-room-spinning medicine. 13. God must love stupid people; He made so many. 14. The gene pool could use a little chlorine. 15. Consciousness: That annoying time between naps. 16. Ever stop to think, and forget to start again? 17. Being "over the hill" is much better than being under it! 18. Wrinkled Was Not One of the Things I Wanted to Be When I grew up. 19. Procrastinate Now! 20. I Have a Degree in Liberal Arts; Do You Want Fries With that? 21. A hangover is the wrath of grapes. 22. A journey of a thousand miles begins with a cash advance 23. Stupidity is not a handicap. Park elsewhere! 24. They call it PMS because Mad Cow Disease was already taken. 25. He who dies with the most toys is nonetheless dead. 26. A picture is worth a thousand words, but it uses up three- thousand times the memory. 27. Ham and eggs. A day's work for a chicken, a lifetime commitment for a pig. 28. The trouble with life is there's no background music. 29. The original point and click interface was a Smith and Wesson. 30. I smile because I don't know what the hell is going on. ===================END FORWARDED MESSAGE=================== From dep at linuxandmain.com Fri Apr 8 20:58:50 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Fri Apr 8 20:56:29 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Thirty cute lines In-Reply-To: <20050408211543.ZMBF6521.lakermmtao02.cox.net@enigmaster> References: <20050408211543.ZMBF6521.lakermmtao02.cox.net@enigmaster> Message-ID: <200504082058.50319.dep@linuxandmain.com> and a 31st, stolen from a britcom this week, so obvious i wondered why i had never heard it before: "why do you keep telling me to shut up when it never works?" -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From sjkleinsr at cox.net Sun Apr 10 13:16:29 2005 From: sjkleinsr at cox.net (Stan Klein, Sr.) Date: Sun Apr 10 13:22:02 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Longevity Message-ID: <20050410171629.PGDX18351.lakermmtao08.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> Interesting. This says I can live to be 81. http://www.nmfn.com/tnetwork/longevity_game_popup.html Stan Klein, Sr. Being rich is having money; being wealthy is having time. From prather.js at verizon.net Sun Apr 10 21:04:49 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Sun Apr 10 21:17:31 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: The Bulwer-Lytton contest winners as in " It Was a Dark and Stormy Night..." Message-ID: <0IER0073HCC2901K@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> ==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== > ˙These are the 10 winners of this year's Bulwer-Lytton > contest --AKA Dark > and Stormy Night Contest-- (run by the English Dept. of > San Jose State > University), wherein one writes only the first line of a > bad novel: > ***************************************************************** *********** > 10) As a scientist, Throckmorton knew that if he were > ever to break wind in > the echo chamber, he would never hear the end of it." > ***************************************************************** *********** > 9) "Just beyond the Narrows, the river widens." > ***************************************************************** *********** > 8) "With a curvaceous figure that Venus would have > envied, a tanned, > unblemished oval face framed with lustrous thick brown > hair, deep azure-blue > eyes fringed with long black lashes, perfect teeth that > vied for > competition, and a small straight nose, Marilee had a > beauty that defied > description." > ***************************************************************** *********** > 7) "Andre, a simple peasant, had only one thing on his > mind as he crept > along the East wall: > "Andre creep... Andre creep... Andre creep." > ***************************************************************** *********** > 6) "Stanislaus Smedley, a man always on the cutting edge > of narcissism, was > about to give his body and soul to a back alley > sex-change surgeon to become > the woman he loved." > ***************************************************************** *********** > ˙ > ˙5) "Although Sarah had an abnormal fear of mice, it did > not keep her˙from > eeking out a living at a local pet store."˙ > ˙**************************************************************** *********** > *˙˙ > ˙4) "Stanley looked quite bored and somewhat detached, > but then penguins > often do."˙ > ˙**************************************************************** *********** > *˙˙ > ˙3) "Like an over-ripe beefsteak tomato rimmed with > cottage cheese, the > corpulent remains of Santa Claus lay dead on the hotel > floor."˙ > ˙**************************************************************** *********** > *˙˙ > ˙2) "Mike Hardware was the kind of private eye who didn't > know the meaning > of the word 'fear'; a man who could laugh in the face of > danger and spit in > the eye of death -- in short, a moron with suicidal > tendencies."˙ > ˙**************************************************************** *********** > *˙˙ > ˙AND THE WINNER IS.....˙ > ˙**************************************************************** *********** > *˙ > ˙1) "The sun oozed over the horizon, shoved aside > darkness, crept along˙the > greensward, and, with sickly fingers, pushed through the > castle > window,˙revealing the pillaged princess, hand at throat, > crown asunder, > gaping˙in frenzied horror at the sated, sodden amphibian > lying beside her, > disbelieving the magnitude of the frog's deception, > screaming madly, "YOU > LIED !" Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From prather.js at verizon.net Sun Apr 10 21:16:38 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Sun Apr 10 21:17:39 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: A good WW II True STORY Message-ID: <0IER00JZRCVQG1W4@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> This is a good read! ==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== > > > Angel's Playmate > >> by "Stallion 51" > >> > >> He was tired of trying to find cover where there was > none. Carr hadn't > >> realized that Czechoslovakian forests had no > underbrush until, at the > >> edge > >> of the farm field, he struggled out of his parachute > and dragged it > > into > >> the woods. During the times he had been screaming > along at tree top > > level > >> in his P-51 "Angels Playmate" the forests and fields > had been nothing > >> more > >> than a green blur behind the Messerchmitts, > Focke-Wulfs, trains and > >> trucks > >> he had in his sights. He never expected to find > himself a pedestrian > > far > >> behind enemy lines. The instant antiaircraft shrapnel > ripped into the > >> engine, he knew he was in trouble, serious trouble. > Clouds of coolant > >> steam > >> hissing through jagged holes in the cowling told Carr > he was about to > >> ride > >> the silk elevator down to a long walk back to his > squadron. A very long > >> walk. This had not been part of the mission plan. > >> > >> Several years before, when 18-year-old Bruce Carr > enlisted in the Army, > >> in > >> no way could he have imagined himself taking a > walking tour of rural > >> Czechoslovakia with Germans everywhere around him. > When he enlisted,all > >> he > >> had just focused on flying airplanes .. fighter > airplanes. By the time > > he > >> had joined the military, Carr already knew how to > fly.He had been > > flying > >> as > >> a private pilot since 1939, soloing in a $25 Piper > Cub his father had > >> bought from a disgusted pilot who had left it lodged > securely in the > > top > >> of > >> a tree. His instructor had been an Auburn, NY, native > by the name of > >> Johnny > >> Bruns. "In 1942, after I enlisted, " as Bruce Carr > remembers it, "we > > went > >> to meet our instructors. I was the last cadet left in > the assignment > > room > >> and was nervous. Then the door opened and out stepped > the man who was > > to > >> be > >> my military flight instructor. It was Johnny Bruns!" > >> > >> "We took a Stearman to an outlying field, doing > aerobatics all the way; > >> then he got out and soloed me. That was my first > flight in the > > military." > >> The guy I had in advanced training in the AT-6 had > just graduated > > himself > >> and didn't know a bit more than I did," Carr can't > help but smile, as > > he > >> remembers .. which meant neither one of us knew > anything. Zilch! After > >> three or four hours in the AT-6, they took me and a > few others > > aside,told > >> us we were going to fly P-40s and we left for Tipton, > Georgia.We got to > >> Tipton, and a lieutenant just back from North Africa > kneeled on the > >> P-40's > >> wing, showed me where all the levers were, made sure > I knew how > >> everything > >> worked, then said ' If you can get it started .. go > fly it'...just like > >> that ! I was 19 years old and thought I knew > everything. I didn't know > >> enough to be scared. They didn't tell us what to > do.They just said 'Go > >> fly,' so I buzzed every cow in that part of the > state.Nineteen years > > old > >> . > >> and with 1100 horsepower, what did they expect? Then > we went overseas." > >> > >> By today's standards, Carr and that first contingent > of pilots shipped > > to > >> England were painfully short of experience. They had > so little flight > >> time > >> that today, they would barely have their civilian > pilot's license. > > Flight > >> training eventually became more formal, but in those > early days, their > >> training had a hint of fatalistic Darwinism to it: if > they learned fast > >> enough to survive, they were ready to move on to the > next > > step.Including > >> his 40 hours in the P-40 terrorizing Georgia, Carr > had less than160 > > hours > >> total flight time when he arrived in England. > >> > >> His group in England was to be the pioneering group > that would take the > >> Mustang into combat, and he clearly remembers his > introduction to the > >> airplane. " I thought I was an old P-40 pilot and the > P-51B would be no > >> big > >> deal. But I was wrong! I was truly impressed with the > airplane. REALLY > >> impressed! It flew like an airplane. I FLEW a P-40, > but in the P-51... > > I > >> was PART OF the airplane.. and it was part of me. > There was a world of > >> difference. "When he first arrived in England, the > instructions were, ' > >> This > >> is a P-51. Go fly it. Soon, we'll have to form a > unit, so fly.' A lot > > of > >> English cows were buzzed. > >> > >> On my first long-range mission, we just kept > climbing, and I'd never > > had > >> an > >> airplane above about 10,000 feet before. Then we were > at 30,000 feet, > > and > >> I > >> couldn't believe it! I'd gone to church as a kid, and > I knew that's > > where > >> the angels were and that's when I named my airplane > 'Angels Playmate.' > > -- > >> Then a bunch of Germans roared down through us, and > my leader > > immediately > >> dropped tanks and turned hard for home. But I'm not > that smart. I'm 19 > >> years old and this SOB shoots at me, and I'm not going > to let him get > >> away > >> with > >> it. We went round and round, and I'm really mad > because he shot at me. > >> Childish emotions, in retrospect. He couldn't shake > me .. but I > > couldn't > >> get on his tail to get any hits either. Before long, > we're right down > > in > >> the trees. I'm shooting, but I'm not hitting. I am, > however, scaring > > the > >> hell out of him. I'm at least as excited as he is. > Then I tell myself > > to > >> calm down.We're roaring around within a few feet of > the ground, and he > >> pulls up to go over some trees, so I just pull the > trigger and keep it > >> down. The gun barrels burned out and one bullet, a > tracer, came > > tumbling > >> out and made agreat huge arc. It came down and hit him > on the left wing > >> about wherethe > >> aileron was. He pulled up, off came the canopy, and > he jumped out, but > >> too > >> low for the chute to open and the airplane crashed. I > didn't shoot him > >> down, I scared him to death with one bullet hole in > his left wing. My > >> first > >> victory wasn't a kill; it was more of a suicide. > >> > >> The rest of Carr's 14 victories were much more > conclusive. Being a > >> red-hot > >> fighter pilot, however, was absolutely no use to him > as he lay > > shivering > >> in > >> the Czechoslovakian forest. He knew he would die if > he didn't get some > >> food > >> and shelter soon. "I knew where the German field was > because I'd flown > >> over > >> it, so I headed in that direction to surrender. I > intended to walk in > > the > >> main gate, but it was late afternoon and, for some > reason, I had second > >> thoughts and decided to wait in the woods until > morning. While I was > >> lying > >> there, I saw a crew working on an Fw 190 right at the > edge of the > > woods. > >> When they were done, I assumed, just like you assume > in America, that > > the > >> thing was all finished. The cowling's on. The engine > has been run. The > >> fuel > >> truck has been there. It's ready to go. Maybe a dumb > assumption for a > >> young > >> fellow, but I assumed so. So, I got in the airplane > and spent the night > >> all > >> hunkered down in the cockpit. > >> > >> Before dawn, it got light and I started studying the > cockpit. I can't > >> read > >> German, so I couldn't decipher dials and I couldn't > find the normal > >> switches like there were in American airplanes. I > kept looking , and on > >> the > >> right side was a smooth panel. Under this was a > compartment with > >> something > >> I would classify as circuit breakers. They didn't look > like ours, but > >> they > >> weren't regular switches either. I began to think > that the Germans were > >> probably no different from the Americans in that they > would turn off > > all > >> the switches when finished with the airplane. I had > no earthly idea > > what > >> those circuit breakers or switches did, but I > reversed every one of > > them. > >> If they were off, that would turn them on. When I did > that, the gauges > >> showed there was electricity on the airplane. > >> > >> I'd seen this metal T-handle on the right side of the > cockpit that had > > a > >> word on it that looked enough like 'starter' for me > to think that' what > >> it > >> was. But when I pulled it, nothing happened. Nothing. > But if pulling > >> doesn't work, you push. And when I did, an inertia > starter started > >> winding > >> up. I let it go for a while, then pulled on the handle > and the engine > >> started. > >> > >> The sun had yet to make it over the far trees and the > air base was just > >> waking up, getting ready to go to war. The Fw 190 was > one of many > >> dispersed > >> throughout the woods, and at that time of the > morning, the sound of the > >> engine must have been heard by many Germans not far > away on the main > >> base. > >> But even if they heard it, there was no reason for > alarm. The last > > thing > >> they expected was one of their fighters taxiing out > with a weary > > Mustang > >> pilot at the controls. Carr, however, wanted to take > no chances. > >> > >> "The taxiway came out of the woods and turned right > towards where I > > knew > >> the airfield was because I'd watched them land and > take off while I was > >> in > >> the trees. "On the left side of the taxiway, there > was a shallow ditch > >> and > >> a space where there had been two hangars. The slabs > were there, but the > >> hangars were gone, and the area around them had been > cleaned of all > >> debris. > >> I didn't want to go to the airfield, so I plowed down > through the > > ditch, > >> and when the airplane started up the other side, I > shoved the throttle > >> forward > >> and took off right between where the two hangars had > been. > >> > >> At that point, Bruce Carr had no time to look around > to see what effect > >> the > >> sight of a Focke-Wulf erupting from the trees had on > the Germans. > >> Undoubtedly, they were confused, but not unduly > concerned. After all, > > it > >> was probably just one of their maverick pilots doing > something against > >> the > >> rules. They didn't know it was one of OUR maverick > pilots doing > > something > >> against the rules. > >> > >> Carr had problems more immediate than a bunch of > confused Germans. He > > had > >> just pulled off the perfect plane-jacking; but he > knew nothing about > > the > >> airplane, couldn't read the placards and had 200 > miles of enemy > > territory > >> to cross. At home, there would be hundreds of his > friends and fellow > >> warriors, all of whom were, at that moment, preparing > their guns to > > shoot > >> at anything marked with swastikas and > crosses-airplanes identical to > > the > >> one Bruce Carr was at that moment flying. But Carr > wasn't thinking that > >> far > >> ahead. First, he had to get there, and that meant > learning how to fly > > the > >> airplane. There were two buttons behind the throttle > and three buttons > >> behind those two. I wasn't sure what to push, so I > pushed one button > > and > >> nothing happened. I pushed the other and the gear > started up. As soon > > as > >> I > >> felt it coming up and I cleared the fence at the edge > of the German > >> field, > >> Itook it down little lower and headed for home. All I > wanted to do was > >> clear the ground by about six inches, and there was > only one throttle > >> position for me: full forward. > >> > >> As I headed for home, I pushed one of the other three > buttons, and the > >> flaps came part way down. I pushed the button next to > it, and they came > >> up > >> again. So I knew how to get the flaps down. But that > was all I knew. I > >> can't make heads or tails out of any of the > instruments. None. I can't > >> even > >> figure how to change the prop pitch. But I don't > sweat that, because > >> props > >> are full forward when you shut down anyway, and it > was running fine. > > This > >> time, it was German cows that were buzzed, although, > as he streaked > > cross > >> fields and through the trees only a few feet off the > ground, that was > > not > >> the intent. At something over 350 miles an hour below > tree-top level, > > he > >> was trying to be a difficult target, but as he > crossed the lines, he > >> wasn't > >> difficult enough. There was no doubt when I crossed > the lines because > >> every > >> SOB and his brother who had a .50-caliber machine gun > shot at me. It > > was > >> all over the place, and I had no idea which way to > go. I didn't do much > >> dodging because I was just as likely to fly into > bullets as around > > them. > >> > >> When he hopped over the last row of trees and found > himself crossing > > his > >> own airfield, he pulled up hard to set up for landing. > His mind was on > >> flying the airplane. I pitched up, pulled the throttle > back and punched > >> the > >> buttons I knew would put the gear and flaps down. I > felt the flaps come > >> down, but the gear wasn't doing anything. I came > around and pitched up > >> again, still punching the button. Nothing was > happening and I was > > really > >> frustrated. > >> > >> He had been so intent on figuring out his airplane > problems, he was > >> putting > >> on a very tempting show for the ground crew. As I > started up the last > >> time, > >> I saw the air defense guys ripping the tarps off the > quad .50s that > >> ringed > >> the field. I hadn't noticed the machine guns before, > but I was sure > >> noticing them right then. I roared around in as tight > a pattern as I > >> could > >> fly and chopped the throttle. With gear up, I slid to > a halt on the > >> runway > >> and it was a nice belly job, if I say so myself. > >> > >> His antics over the runway had drawn quite a crowd, > and the airplane > > had > >> barely stopped sliding before there were MPs up on > the wings trying to > >> drag > >> him out of the airpane by his arms. They didn't > realize he was still > >> strapped in. I started throwing some good Anglo-Saxon > swear words at > >> them, > >> and they let loose while I tried to get the seat belt > undone, but my > >> hands > >> would not work, and I couldn't do it. Then they > started pulling on me > >> again. They still were not convinced I was an > American. I was yelling > > and > >> hollering; then, suddenly, they let go, and a face > drops down into the > >> cockpit in front of mine. It was my Group Commander, > George R. Bickel. > >> "Bickel said, 'Carr, where in the hell have you been > and what have you > >> been > >> doing now?'" Bruce Carr was home and entered the > record books, as the > >> only > >> pilot known to leave on a mission flying a Mustang > and return flying a > >> Focke-Wulf!! > >> > >> For several days after the ordeal, he had trouble > eating and sleeping, > >> but > >> when things again fell into place, he took some of > the other pilots out > >> to > >> show them the airplane and how it worked. One of them > pointed out a > > small > >> handle under the glare shield that he hadn't noticed > before. When he > >> pulled > >> it, the landing gear unlocked and fell out. The > handle was a separate, > >> mechanical up lock. At least, he had figured out the > important > >> things.Carr > >> finished the war with 15 aerial victories after > flying 172 missions, > >> which > >> included three bailouts because of ground fire. He > stayed in the > > service, > >> eventually flying 51 missions in Korea in F-86s and > 286 missions in > >> Vietnam, flying F-100s. That's an amazing 509 combat > missions. What > > makes > >> a > >> fitting ending to this story is that there is no > ending. > >> > >> Bruce Carr is still actively flying and routinely > shows up at air shows > >> in > >> a P-51D painted up exactly like "Angel's Playmate." > There is no such > >> thing > >> as an ex-fighter pilot. They never cease being what > they once were, > >> whether > >> they are in the cockpit or not. There is a profile > into which almost > >> every > >> one of the breed fits, and it is the charter within > that profile that > >> makes > >> the pilot a fighter pilot-not the other way around. > And make no mistake > >> about it, Colonel Bruce Carr is definitely a fighter > pilot. > >> - - - - > >> > >> Good stuff! > > > > ===================END FORWARDED MESSAGE=================== Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From dep at linuxandmain.com Mon Apr 11 00:25:09 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Mon Apr 11 00:22:18 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] concert review, sort of Message-ID: <200504110025.09830.dep@linuxandmain.com> greets, one and all . . . i am just back from the most amazing concert i have ever attended. it was by a fellow name of tommy emmanuel, and for more than two hours he did the impossible with a guitar. i'll not attempt to describe it more than that -- i got his dvd as proof and to save having to try to describe his work. he makes sounds come from an acoustic guitar that an acoustic guitar simply cannot make, and all this without processing and stuff. this on top of the fact that he is probably the best guitar player in the world -- chet atkins thought he was -- and the fact that the sounds he causes the guitar to make are very nice sounds. what's more, he is really accessible. absolutely anybody would both love and be amazed by his performance. the place i saw him is a small hall holding maybe 200 people. this included some professional studio musicians (one of whom i overheard at intermission saying, "i've got to look in the want ads, because i'm quitting") as well as just plain folks. everybody, to a person, was gaga. i sat next to jorma kaukonen, who is no slouch with a guitar, who kept looking over and grinning at how good this guy is. if he comes anywhere within a couple days drive of where you are, go see him. if you have to take time off from work, do it. if you can't get time off, quit your job. he has a website that lists all kinds of stuff such as tour dates and so on. i am just blown away. i never saw anything like it. -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From prather.js at verizon.net Mon Apr 11 08:11:03 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Mon Apr 11 08:11:30 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: It get worse!!!! Message-ID: <0IES009D976FC927@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> ==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== > > > DEAD DUCK > > > > A woman brought a very limp duck into a veterinary > surgeon. As she lay > > >her pet on the table, the vet pulled out his stethoscope > and listened to > > >the > > >bird's chest. After a moment or two, the vet shook his > head sadly and > > >said, > > >"I'm so sorry, your pet has passed away." > > > > > > > > The distressed owner wailed, "Are you sure?" > > > > > > > > "Yes, I'm sure. The duck is dead," he replied. > > > > > > > > "How can you be so sure", she protested. "I mean, you > haven't done any > > >testing on him or anything. He might just be in a coma > or something." > > > > > > > > The vet rolled his eyes, turned around and left the > room. He returned > > >a > > >few moments later with a black Labrador Retriever. As > the duck's owner > > >looked on in amazement, the dog stood on his hind legs, > put his front > > >paws > > >on the examination table and sniffed the duck from top > to bottom. He > > >then > > >looked at the vet with sad eyes and shook his head. The > vet patted the > > >dog > > >and took it out and returned a few moments later with a > beautiful cat. > > >The > > >cat jumped up on the table and also sniffed the bird > from its peak to its > > >tail and back again. The cat sat back on its haunches, > shook its head, > > >meowed softly, jumped down and strolled out of the room. > > > > > > > > The vet looked at the woman and said, "I'm sorry, but > as I said, this > > >is > > >most definitely, 100% certifiably, a dead duck." Then > the vet turned to > > >his > > >computer terminal, hit a few keys and produced a bill, > which he handed to > > >the woman > > > > > > > > The duck's owner, still in shock, took the bill. > "$150!" she cried. > > >"$150 > > >just to tell me my duck is dead?!!" > > > > > > > > The vet shrugged. "I'm sorry. If you'd taken my word > for it, the bill > > >would have been $20. But what with the Lab Report and > the Cat Scan, it > > >all > > >adds up." > > ===================END FORWARDED MESSAGE=================== Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From prather.js at verizon.net Mon Apr 11 08:16:09 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Mon Apr 11 08:17:31 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] concert review, sort of In-Reply-To: <200504110025.09830.dep@linuxandmain.com> Message-ID: <0IES00BLC7EY62E4@vms048.mailsrvcs.net> On Mon, 11 Apr 2005 00:25:09 -0400, dep wrote: >i am just blown away. i never saw anything like it. What type of music does he play? Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From dep at linuxandmain.com Mon Apr 11 11:33:47 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Mon Apr 11 11:31:34 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] concert review, sort of In-Reply-To: <0IES00BLC7EY62E4@vms048.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0IES00BLC7EY62E4@vms048.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <200504111133.47723.dep@linuxandmain.com> quoth Jerry Prather: | On Mon, 11 Apr 2005 00:25:09 -0400, dep wrote: | >i am just blown away. i never saw anything like it. | | What type of music does he play? good question. he was a protege of chet atkins, but he's from australia, so it's hard to say. he played everything from "blue moon" to boogie to serious blues, as well as some guitar pyrotechnics that might be described as sound effects -- for instance, he did "somewhere over the rannbow" in a way that sounded as if it were being played on a harp, and he did another piece in a way that made it seem as if it were coming from a country fiddle. it was as though the harlem globetrotters were playing guitar instead of basketball. he's also very funny: "i've had a request," he said after intermission, "but i shall keep playing anyway." btw, he is one of the three persons in the world (the other two being atkins and jerry reed) who can rightly append "cgp" to their names. it stands for "certified guitar player." -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From sjkleinsr at cox.net Wed Apr 13 04:30:41 2005 From: sjkleinsr at cox.net (Stan Klein, Sr.) Date: Wed Apr 13 04:32:18 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] stop the sheep Message-ID: <20050413083043.GFWL21504.lakermmtao06.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> Subject: stop the sheep Potentially addictive! Reaction Time Test Click here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/humanbody/sleep/sheep/reaction_version5.swf Stan Klein, Sr. Being rich is having money; being wealthy is having time. From sjkleinsr at cox.net Wed Apr 13 04:34:34 2005 From: sjkleinsr at cox.net (Stan Klein, Sr.) Date: Wed Apr 13 04:35:11 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Improve Your Knowledge Of U.S. Geography . . . . . . . Message-ID: <20050413083437.KZEV3789.lakermmtao05.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> http://www.sheppardsoftware.com/states_experiment_drag-drop_Intermed_State15s_500.html Stan Klein, Sr. Being rich is having money; being wealthy is having time. From mriddle at papillion.ne.us Wed Apr 13 08:02:12 2005 From: mriddle at papillion.ne.us (Mike Riddle) Date: Wed Apr 13 08:04:14 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Ted Kennedy Message-ID: <20050413120213.ITJQ29182.lakermmtao01.cox.net@enigmaster> ==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== *Ted Kennedy Fights Removal of Feeding Tube* *Written by **_Jeremy Robb_* * Monday, March 28, 2005* WASHINGTON, DC --- Ted Kennedy, who was recently declared brain-dead by his physician, is fighting for his life. The Senator's family is trying to have his feeding tube removed to allow him to die a sober death. The tube, attached to a bottle of vodka and a bottle of gin, has been utilized by the senator for his entire adult life. Medical experts believe removal will almost certainly result in death. "This is a very complex situation," said one medical expert. "Senator Kennedy appears to be functioning normally to many people, but it is quite obvious that the man is brain-dead by his public comments. Most of us in the medical community think he should be allowed to have a dignified death by sobering him up and removing his feeding tube." Liberals were stuck in a quandary today as they want Terri Schiavo dead, but they don't want Ted Kennedy to die. "This is a moral dilemma to many people," said Commie Greenstein, a liberal living in New York. "Fortunately, most of us don't really make decisions based on any morals, so it's okay if we want one person to die while allowing a brain-dead person to live." Alcohol manufacturers around the world are scrambling to raise money for the "Keep Kennedy Alive" fund. Removing his feeding tube is predicted to cause a 12% annual decrease in global alcohol consumption. Some manufacturers risk going out of business as soon as the feeding tube is removed. */About the Writer:/*/ Jeremy Robb is a San Francisco resident and satirist who notes that he is on a "one man's jihad against liberalism." He is the editor of the "Jerhad!com Newsletter" and his website is at //_http://www.jerhad.com_/ /. Jeremy receives e-mail at //_jeremy@jerhad.com_/ /./ ===================END FORWARDED MESSAGE=================== From mriddle at papillion.ne.us Wed Apr 13 08:21:23 2005 From: mriddle at papillion.ne.us (Mike Riddle) Date: Wed Apr 13 08:22:57 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] FW: US-CERT Technical Cyber Security Alert TA05-102A -- Multiple Vulnerabilities in Microsoft Windows Components Message-ID: <20050413122123.JGGT28448.lakermmtao09.cox.net@enigmaster> What a Shock and Surprise! ==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== National Cyber Alert System Technical Cyber Security Alert TA05-102A Multiple Vulnerabilities in Microsoft Windows Components Original release date: April 12, 2005 Last revised: -- Source: US-CERT Systems Affected * Microsoft Windows Systems For a complete list of affected versions of the Windows operating systems and components, refer to the Microsoft Security Bulletins. Overview Microsoft has released a Security Bulletin Summary for April, 2005. This summary includes several bulletins that address vulnerabilities in various Windows applications and components. Exploitation of some vulnerabilities can result in the remote execution of arbitrary code by a remote attacker. Details of the vulnerabilities and their impacts are provided below. I. Description The list below provides a mapping between Microsoft's Security Bulletins and the related US-CERT Vulnerability Notes. More information related to the vulnerabilities is available in these documents. Microsoft Security Bulletin MS05-020: Cumulative Security Update for Internet Explorer (890923) VU#774338 Microsoft Internet Explorer DHTML objects contain a race condition VU#756122 Microsoft Internet Explorer URL validation routine contains a buffer overflow VU#222050 Microsoft Internet Explorer Content Advisor contains a buffer overflow Microsoft Security Bulletin MS05-02: Vulnerability in Exchange Server Could Allow Remote Code Execution (894549) VU#275193 Microsoft Exchange Server contains unchecked buffer in SMTP extended verb handling Microsoft Security Bulletin MS05-022: Vulnerability in MSN Messenger Could Lead to Remote Code Execution (896597) VU#633446 Microsoft MSN Messenger GIF processing buffer overflow Microsoft Security Bulletin MS05-019: Vulnerabilities in TCP/IP Could Allow Remote Code Execution and Denial of Service (893066) VU#233754 Microsoft Windows does not adequately validate IP packets II. Impact Exploitation of these vulnerabilities may permit a remote attacker to execute arbitrary code on a vulnerable Windows system, or cause a denial-of-service condition. III. Solution Apply a patch Microsoft has provided the patches for these vulnerabilities in the Security Bulletins and on Windows Update. Appendix A. References * Microsoft's Security Bulletin Summary for April, 2005 - < http://www.microsoft.com/technet/security/bulletin/ms05-apr.mspx> * US-CERT Vulnerability Note VU#774338 - * US-CERT Vulnerability Note VU#756122 - * US-CERT Vulnerability Note VU#222050 - * US-CERT Vulnerability Note VU#275193 - * US-CERT Vulnerability Note VU#633446 - * US-CERT Vulnerability Note VU#233754 - _________________________________________________________________ Feedback can be directed to the authors: Will Dormann, Jeff Gennari, Chad Dougherty, Ken MacInnis, Jason Rafail, Art Manion, and Jeff Havrilla. _________________________________________________________________ This document is available from: _________________________________________________________________ Copyright 2005 Carnegie Mellon University. Terms of use: _________________________________________________________________ Revision History April 12, 2005: Initial release National Cyber Alert System Technical Cyber Security Alert TA05-102A Multiple Vulnerabilities in Microsoft Windows Components Original release date: April 12, 2005 Last revised: -- Source: US-CERT Systems Affected * Microsoft Windows Systems For a complete list of affected versions of the Windows operating systems and components, refer to the Microsoft Security Bulletins. Overview Microsoft has released a Security Bulletin Summary for April, 2005. This summary includes several bulletins that address vulnerabilities in various Windows applications and components. Exploitation of some vulnerabilities can result in the remote execution of arbitrary code by a remote attacker. Details of the vulnerabilities and their impacts are provided below. I. Description The list below provides a mapping between Microsoft's Security Bulletins and the related US-CERT Vulnerability Notes. More information related to the vulnerabilities is available in these documents. Microsoft Security Bulletin MS05-020: Cumulative Security Update for Internet Explorer (890923) VU#774338 Microsoft Internet Explorer DHTML objects contain a race condition VU#756122 Microsoft Internet Explorer URL validation routine contains a buffer overflow VU#222050 Microsoft Internet Explorer Content Advisor contains a buffer overflow Microsoft Security Bulletin MS05-02: Vulnerability in Exchange Server Could Allow Remote Code Execution (894549) VU#275193 Microsoft Exchange Server contains unchecked buffer in SMTP extended verb handling Microsoft Security Bulletin MS05-022: Vulnerability in MSN Messenger Could Lead to Remote Code Execution (896597) VU#633446 Microsoft MSN Messenger GIF processing buffer overflow Microsoft Security Bulletin MS05-019: Vulnerabilities in TCP/IP Could Allow Remote Code Execution and Denial of Service (893066) VU#233754 Microsoft Windows does not adequately validate IP packets II. Impact Exploitation of these vulnerabilities may permit a remote attacker to execute arbitrary code on a vulnerable Windows system, or cause a denial-of-service condition. III. Solution Apply a patch Microsoft has provided the patches for these vulnerabilities in the Security Bulletins and on Windows Update. Appendix A. References * Microsoft's Security Bulletin Summary for April, 2005 - < http://www.microsoft.com/technet/security/bulletin/ms05-apr.mspx> * US-CERT Vulnerability Note VU#774338 - * US-CERT Vulnerability Note VU#756122 - * US-CERT Vulnerability Note VU#222050 - * US-CERT Vulnerability Note VU#275193 - * US-CERT Vulnerability Note VU#633446 - * US-CERT Vulnerability Note VU#233754 - _________________________________________________________________ Feedback can be directed to the authors: Will Dormann, Jeff Gennari, Chad Dougherty, Ken MacInnis, Jason Rafail, Art Manion, and Jeff Havrilla. _________________________________________________________________ This document is available from: _________________________________________________________________ Copyright 2005 Carnegie Mellon University. Terms of use: _________________________________________________________________ Revision History April 12, 2005: Initial release ===================END FORWARDED MESSAGE=================== From m.o.davis at gte.net Wed Apr 13 08:57:35 2005 From: m.o.davis at gte.net (Davis Mark) Date: Wed Apr 13 08:59:13 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Swimming in Asia Message-ID: <94c2cd1bb9e1e913a22c7629b4a3a984@gte.net> http://www.hkmj.org.hk/hkmj/abstracts/v11n2/110.htm -- Mark Davis San Angelo, TX From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Thu Apr 14 00:03:57 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Thu Apr 14 00:04:27 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Swimming in Asia In-Reply-To: <94c2cd1bb9e1e913a22c7629b4a3a984@gte.net> References: <94c2cd1bb9e1e913a22c7629b4a3a984@gte.net> Message-ID: <425DEBAD.1080508@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Davis Mark wrote: > http://www.hkmj.org.hk/hkmj/abstracts/v11n2/110.htm It warmed my heart to learn that the leech was made comfortable prior to its extraction. -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From bob.bernstein at gmail.com Thu Apr 14 01:58:10 2005 From: bob.bernstein at gmail.com (Bob Bernstein) Date: Thu Apr 14 01:59:18 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Whither AMD? Message-ID: The Wall Street Journal April 14, 2005 AMD Posts $17.4 Million Loss, Hurt by Its Flash-Memory Unit Spansion Operation Unveils Plans for Public Offering; Hurdles Remain for Chips By DON CLARK Staff Reporter of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL April 14, 2005; Page B5 Advanced Micro Devices Inc. posted a first-quarter loss, dragged down by a memory-chip business that is heading toward greater independence though a public offering. AMD, of Sunnyvale, Calif., is the perennial No. 2 to Intel Corp., Santa Clara, Calif., in making microprocessor chips, the devices that act as the brains in personal computers. That business did well in the first quarter, with microprocessor revenue rising 31% from the year-earlier period. But because of Spansion, a unit that sells chips known as flash memory, AMD reported a net loss of $17.4 million, or four cents a share, for the period ended March 27. That compares with year-earlier net income of $45.1 million, or 12 cents a share. Revenue slipped slightly to $1.23 billion from $1.24 billion. Spansion, which is 60%-owned by AMD and 40%-owned by Japan's Fujitsu Ltd., has been hurt by factors that include price-cutting by Intel and other makers of flash chips. The unit posted a $110 million operating loss for the first quarter on revenue that declined 29% to $447 million. AMD executives had vowed to take action to reduce the financial impact of Spansion's results, setting off speculation that it might sell or spin off the unit. Instead, Spansion yesterday filed for a $600 million initial public offering of shares, which will leave AMD a majority owner but could help Spansion raise money independently. "We need to enable completely different business models," said Hector Ruiz, AMD's chief executive officer, during a conference call with analysts. Adam Parker, an analyst at Sanford C. Bernstein & Co., said AMD not long ago had touted the benefits of owning Spansion, which temporarily took the lead from Intel in the variety of flash chips used in cellphones. "I never think an IPO is good when it is designed to extract a tumor from a business, as opposed to extracting value," he said. As a microprocessor-only company, AMD still will face a challenge in improving profit margins while boosting spending to try to reduce Intel's big advantage in manufacturing capacity, Mr. Parker said. Still, Rick Whittington, an analyst at Caris & Co., argued that AMD did better in microprocessors in the first quarter "than we had any right to expect" and is in a good position to do well in the second half of the year. Mr. Ruiz confirmed that AMD will ship its first chips containing two processors on April 21, starting with models for server systems. Intel plans to announce such "dual-core" chips for personal computers by the end of the month but hasn't been more specific. Mr. Ruiz also applauded an action by Japan's Fair Trade Commission to compel Intel to end certain marketing practices there, which should create "a much more balanced competitive playing field in Japan," he said. AMD's shares at 4 p.m. were at $17.06, off 17 cents, in New York Stock Exchange composite trading, but they rose in afterhours trading following the announcements to $17.31 apiece. Write to Don Clark at don.clark@wsj.com1 URL for this article: http://online.wsj.com/article/0,,SB111341235941805996,00.html -- "The fact that the system allows stupid settings is not a bug." Christos Zoulas From prather.js at verizon.net Thu Apr 14 08:33:21 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Thu Apr 14 08:34:45 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Swimming in Asia In-Reply-To: <425DEBAD.1080508@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <0IEX00LHRS7L6P7A@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> On Thu, 14 Apr 2005 00:03:57 -0400, Bob Bernstein wrote: >It warmed my heart to learn that the leech was made comfortable prior to >its extraction. Yeah, but they still removed it from its feeding tube. Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From bob.bernstein at gmail.com Thu Apr 14 12:36:20 2005 From: bob.bernstein at gmail.com (Bob Bernstein) Date: Thu Apr 14 12:41:49 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Swimming in Asia In-Reply-To: <0IEX00LHRS7L6P7A@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> References: <425DEBAD.1080508@bernstein.providence.ri.us> <0IEX00LHRS7L6P7A@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: On 4/14/05, Jerry Prather wrote: > Yeah, but they still removed it from its feeding tube. You're right! They killed an animal to save a human: Alert PETA! -- "The fact that the system allows stupid settings is not a bug." Christos Zoulas From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Mon Apr 18 09:44:25 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Mon Apr 18 09:45:21 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] I don't get it. Message-ID: <4263B9B9.2030807@bernstein.providence.ri.us> -=WHO=- plays these things!!??? -------- Original Message -------- __________________________________ TECHNOLOGY ALERT from The Wall Street Journal. April 18, 2005 GameStop agreed to buy rival videogame retailer Electronics Boutique in a cash-and-stock deal initially worth $1.44 billion. __________________________________ -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 253 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature Url : http://mailman.jtan.com/pipermail/os2-right-stuff-l/attachments/20050418/72d27f5e/signature.bin From dep at linuxandmain.com Mon Apr 18 10:04:11 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Mon Apr 18 10:00:15 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] I don't get it. In-Reply-To: <4263B9B9.2030807@bernstein.providence.ri.us> References: <4263B9B9.2030807@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <200504181004.11523.dep@linuxandmain.com> quoth Bob Bernstein: | -=WHO=- plays these things!!??? the same people who keep the dozens of mall stores that specialize in inner-city mulattowear in business. which is to say affluent white kids who affect extremely foolishly the already foolish cultural peccadillos of other ethnic groups. -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Mon Apr 18 10:18:27 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Mon Apr 18 10:19:19 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] I don't get it. In-Reply-To: <200504181004.11523.dep@linuxandmain.com> References: <4263B9B9.2030807@bernstein.providence.ri.us> <200504181004.11523.dep@linuxandmain.com> Message-ID: <4263C1B3.3080308@bernstein.providence.ri.us> dep wrote: > the same people who keep the dozens of mall stores that specialize in > inner-city mulattowear in business. which is to say affluent white kids > who affect extremely foolishly the already foolish cultural peccadillos > of other ethnic groups. I kinda knew that, but what floored me was the _number_ of kids who must have the sort of "disposable" "income" needed to make Electronics Boutique worth almost A BILLION AND A HALF dollars. That freaked me out. -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 253 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature Url : http://mailman.jtan.com/pipermail/os2-right-stuff-l/attachments/20050418/f4fdc69f/signature.bin From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Mon Apr 18 10:30:49 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Mon Apr 18 10:32:28 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] THE END IS NIGH Message-ID: <4263C499.9060700@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Instapundit posted this charming bit of "news" this morning: "A HUGE asteroid which is on a course to miss the Earth by a whisker in 2029 could go round its orbit again and score a direct hit a few years later." http://instapundit.com/archives/022510.phpos2 HOWEVER, one can never get too early a start on one's END OF THE WORLD party! How about a Jack Daniels/Bergman Film Festival? -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 253 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature Url : http://mailman.jtan.com/pipermail/os2-right-stuff-l/attachments/20050418/0f613b7f/signature.bin From mriddle at oasis.novia.net Mon Apr 18 10:34:46 2005 From: mriddle at oasis.novia.net (Mike Riddle) Date: Mon Apr 18 10:35:14 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] I don't get it. In-Reply-To: <4263C1B3.3080308@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <200504181434.j3IEYlc3000699@oasis.novia.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 10:18:27 -0400, Bob Bernstein wrote: >I kinda knew that, but what floored me was the _number_ of kids who must >have the sort of "disposable" "income" needed to make Electronics >Boutique worth almost A BILLION AND A HALF dollars. That freaked me out. Well, they certainly "dispose" of it, don't they? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGP SDK 3.0.3 iQA/AwUBQmPFhv5P0IDbNy34EQLLRwCgubCjlwf/oDkIxhdQPhXL2xwKNysAnieQ fhZoFkq2MYV6xHfYSzyJgoPU =I4Dm -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Mon Apr 18 11:20:23 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Mon Apr 18 11:21:34 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] THE END IS (still) NIGH Message-ID: <4263D037.4010205@bernstein.providence.ri.us> My bad: http://instapundit.com/archives/022510.php -- Disclaimer: Information gladly given, but safety requires avoiding unnecessary conversation. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 253 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.jtan.com/pipermail/os2-right-stuff-l/attachments/20050418/444411d3/signature.bin From dep at linuxandmain.com Mon Apr 18 12:34:36 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Mon Apr 18 12:31:24 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] THE END IS (still) NIGH In-Reply-To: <4263D037.4010205@bernstein.providence.ri.us> References: <4263D037.4010205@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <200504181234.36167.dep@linuxandmain.com> quoth Bob Bernstein: | My bad: | | http://instapundit.com/archives/022510.php "Scientists are proposing that we tag it with a transponder, so that we can keep closer track of its position." um, i think that this is a fundamental problem with scientists. i discussed this very thing about 15 years ago with dr. edward teller, and his point was precisely that scientists and (he was prescient) environmentalists would object to our blowing the thing to smithereens. actually, this would be the perfect rock to play with, to find out if we know the orbital mechanics we think we know. the solution is to be ready to launch something that will make a great big bang *right after* it goes by the first time, so as to divert it such that it goes kersplash into the sun. probably the best way is to set the thing to go bang in a way that seems to slow it down, such that it might hang around not terribly far from us for some time. slowing the orbit is the way to make it fall. also, slowing the orbit would reduce its speed of approach ot the sun such that it would be mostly gaseous by the time it hit the sun. (there are actually all kinds of permutations of this, depending on how good at billiards we think we are and the position of the other balls on the table. for instance, we might be able to slap it into venus, which venus probably would not much like but which would allow us to learn a whole lot about that soggy ball of mud when the thing hit.) -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From kari.m.jackson at verizon.net Mon Apr 18 13:01:04 2005 From: kari.m.jackson at verizon.net (kari.m.jackson@verizon.net) Date: Mon Apr 18 13:02:17 2005 Subject: =?ISO646-US?Q?Re:_[os2-right-stuff-l]_THE_END_IS_=3F(still)_NIGH?= Message-ID: <795034.1113843664917.JavaMail.root@vms063.mailsrvcs.net> If the world ends "in 2034 or a year or two later", that will save us from having to deal with the year-2038 bug. From m.o.davis at gte.net Mon Apr 18 13:13:06 2005 From: m.o.davis at gte.net (Davis Mark) Date: Mon Apr 18 13:14:18 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] I don't get it. In-Reply-To: <4263B9B9.2030807@bernstein.providence.ri.us> References: <4263B9B9.2030807@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <72c414cc39b0a2c5c97ea5b36d667931@gte.net> On Apr 18, 2005, at 8:44 AM, Bob Bernstein wrote: > -=WHO=- plays these things!!??? Just about every adolescent that my kids know. My 16 year old daughter is addicted to playing Halo on Xbox Live. She pays for the subscription ($50/year for unlimited connection time) herself. She's not into serious playing, she mainly likes to get together with other like-minded people and try to find glitches in the various maps the game uses. As long as she continues making straight A's we're just keeping a close eye on what goes on on this end. She's pretty open about what other people are like; she was playing a game the other day where one of her opponents kept calling her a whore. I told her that she should have said "Yeah, I was standing out on the street with your mother last night." -- Mark Davis San Angelo, TX From mriddle at oasis.novia.net Mon Apr 18 13:14:17 2005 From: mriddle at oasis.novia.net (Mike Riddle) Date: Mon Apr 18 13:47:23 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] THE END IS ?(still) NIGH In-Reply-To: <795034.1113843664917.JavaMail.root@vms063.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <200504181714.j3IHEHYb027535@oasis.novia.net> On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 12:01:04 -0500 (CDT), kari.m.jackson@verizon.net wrote: >If the world ends "in 2034 or a year or two later", that will save us >from having to deal with the year-2038 bug. WHAT 2038 bug? From sjkleinsr at cox.net Mon Apr 18 14:25:54 2005 From: sjkleinsr at cox.net (Stan Klein, Sr.) Date: Mon Apr 18 14:27:19 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] THE END IS ?(still) NIGH Message-ID: <20050418182554.LIZ28448.lakermmtao09.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> Does this coincide with the demise of Social Security, thus saving that administration the anguish of seeing it die? > > From: > > If the world ends "in 2034 or a year or two later", that will save us from having to deal with the year-2038 bug. Stan Klein, Sr. Being rich is having money; being wealthy is having time. From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Mon Apr 18 17:15:15 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Mon Apr 18 17:16:25 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] THE END IS ?(still) NIGH In-Reply-To: <200504181714.j3IHEHYb027535@oasis.novia.net> References: <200504181714.j3IHEHYb027535@oasis.novia.net> Message-ID: <42642363.2050809@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Mike Riddle wrote: > WHAT 2038 bug? At some point in that year the number of seconds since January 1, 1970 (the so-called "Unix epoch") will exceed the maximum value that can be stored in a four byte variable. That number is what computers use to do time/date arithmetic. http://www.2038bug.com/ -- Bob Bernstein -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 253 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature Url : http://mailman.jtan.com/pipermail/os2-right-stuff-l/attachments/20050418/e66735f0/signature.bin From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Mon Apr 18 17:19:42 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Mon Apr 18 17:21:29 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] I don't get it. In-Reply-To: <72c414cc39b0a2c5c97ea5b36d667931@gte.net> References: <4263B9B9.2030807@bernstein.providence.ri.us> <72c414cc39b0a2c5c97ea5b36d667931@gte.net> Message-ID: <4264246E.2030009@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Davis Mark wrote: > She's pretty open about what other people are like; she was playing a > game the other day where one of her opponents kept calling her a > whore. I told her that she should have said "Yeah, I was standing out > on the street with your mother last night." Now that's what I call a lively household!!! -- Bob Bernstein -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 253 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature Url : http://mailman.jtan.com/pipermail/os2-right-stuff-l/attachments/20050418/d836063c/signature.bin From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Mon Apr 18 18:02:43 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Mon Apr 18 18:03:32 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Summer's coming... Message-ID: <42642E83.6010007@bernstein.providence.ri.us> http://newton.gso.uri.edu/coastwatch/cwatch-web/cgi-bin/render.cgi?variable=sst&grid=true&palette=HSL256&coast=true&min=0&max=30&land=true&subregion=custom&lat=&lon=&factor=&submit=Submit&product=2005_108_1101_n15_er -- Bob Bernstein -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 253 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature Url : http://mailman.jtan.com/pipermail/os2-right-stuff-l/attachments/20050418/71ce23d7/signature.bin From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Tue Apr 19 16:47:28 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Tue Apr 19 16:48:49 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] We'll be OK now!! Message-ID: <42656E60.8010009@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Bruce is on the job! http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/04/19/revised_torino_scale/ -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Wed Apr 20 14:20:04 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Wed Apr 20 14:21:11 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Inquiring minds want to know! Message-ID: <42669D54.4090407@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Has anyone ever seen Melody Townsel and Mary Mapes together, at the same time, in the same place? COINCIDENCE? YOU BE THE JUDGE! -- Disclaimer: Information gladly given, but safety requires avoiding unnecessary conversation. From rluchor at yahoo.com Thu Apr 21 14:38:38 2005 From: rluchor at yahoo.com (Rich Luchor) Date: Thu Apr 21 14:39:51 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] The Right To Bear Arms Message-ID: <20050421183838.9339.qmail@web31508.mail.mud.yahoo.com> If you value the right to own firearms, read this. An Open Letter from Ronnie Barrett, Barrett Firearms Manufacturing, Inc. Dear Fellow Citizens: In the never-ending battle to destroy our constitution, more "big lie" propaganda is being dumped on our elected officials. The rhetoric given forth by the Violence Policy Center (VPC) so easily deceived the legislators of California, resulting in the banning of fifty caliber rifles because they are powerful and their bullets punch holes when they strike. Even single shot .50 cal rifles were banned. It's hard to believe we live in such a dark time that someone has actually banned a single shot rifle. But as you will see, this is the cleverest of all gun bans, and the end goal is civilian disarmament, the confiscation of your tools of liberty, your rifles. What lies before us is the continuation of the misinformation campaign, trying to coax yet another state to infringe upon the U.S. Constitution as California did. The anti-freedom/anti-gun movement has discovered how transparent they appear when they propose sweeping gun bans and now are successful by biting off a little at a time. Ever so small, many politicians are trading off your rights without you recognizing their violations. First we had the "Saturday Night Special" which was all affordable handguns, then "sniper rifles" which were any scoped deer rifles. Those were obvious, too big a scam to go unnoticed, but with the creation and demonization of the term "assault weapon," the Clinton's Crime bill produced a wasted 10-year setback on your freedoms and safe gun design. Now comes another scam. This time they are shocked to discover that rifles are "accurate and powerful." This is the same bull the officials in the 1950's fell for when they banned the self-unfolding knife. First the knife was demonized by giving it an evil name, "switchblade," then we (the trusting public) were told that the problem of gang violence was solved with its banning. How ridiculous. It's surprising they didn't ban the leather jacket. In reality, gang violence was and is a serious social problem, but it was not related to manually unfolding verses self-unfolding knives. The elected officials voting to ban an object like a knife proved themselves unwilling or uncaring to understand the problem, and thus, incapable of any real solutions. The handful of people that make up the VPC are solely responsible for the big lie on .50's, claiming fantastic destruction capabilities. They manipulate fear by claiming terrorists will use these rifles on targets of our infrastructure. "They will shut down our airports in flames" they claim. VPC's Tom Diaz refers to them as "super guns" lying to his dupable group of politicians, concealing the facts that there are many rifle cartridges that are comparable in performance (those will be added to the list in phase two). He is boldly telling these officials (and all who will listen) that the risk of terrorist attacks on these targets will be solved with the banning of powerful rifles, in this case, the .50 caliber rifle. In reality, terrorism is complex and will be defeated with improved intelligence. In this instance, the officials voting to ban an inanimate object like a rifle prove themselves to be ignorant of the problem of terrorism and are wasting time and resources. You must understand the brilliance of this dangerous back door deception. Your politicians are being told that the fifty is a highly destructive cartridge that can destroy airplanes, fuel transport trucks and depot storages of fuel. They show videos like the one on 60 Minutes showing a 1/2 inch plate of steel being pierced by a .50 cal round while stopping a .308 caliber. This is all to confuse the people, those with little exposure to firearms; their impression concludes that the .50 punches holes in sensitive targets where other rifles cannot. Had they shot actual aluminum that is used on airplane construction, or aluminum or steel used in actual transport or tank construction, both the .50 and the .308 will pierce along with most all centerfire cartridges. But this, they must keep secret. First, with the confusion of massive, (although incorrect) technical data and the hammering of urgency, the VPC demands a ban or strict regulations on rifles that chamber a cartridge that has the ability to penetrate targets. Sound ridiculous? It is. VPC's Tom Diaz appears often on TV with maps of Washington, DC, irresponsibly instructing where to position one's self to illegally fire on vulnerable important targets of our government, promising these specific targets will be safe when .50's are banned. He pressures politicians to act quickly on this URGENT legislation needed to make these terrorist targets safe, hoping they will act before the VPC lies are discovered. Now slow down. A ban on a rifle because the cartridge it shoots penetrates targets? By the legislation naming and defining the targets that are damageable by rifle fire, and in this case, .50 cal. rifle fire, they create a new class of rifles. This new class is not defined by such foolishness as detachable magazines, flash hiders, or pistol grips. Instead, the test is; does it fire a bullet that punches a hole, and can the hole result in damage to specified and named targets? If so, the law-abiding citizen shouldn't be allowed to have this, so they must ban this class of rifle before they can be misused. This is the very thing California has just passed! "Now, we are only talking about those powerful .50 cals, right? It's such a small class, no one will mind or even notice." That's what the VPC's lies have lead you to believe. No, remember they are banning rifles because specific targets named in our infrastructure are susceptible to damage. Now tell me, what centerfire rifle cartridge won't punch holes in those targets? What centerfire rifle cartridge is not powerful? Not many or not any? So, in order to comply with the spirit and intent of the law, the Attorney General or State Secretary must add those cartridges to the banned list. The big lie is exposed. They aren't just talking about .50's. They're after your hunting rifles, centerfire target rifles-just about any rifle you own. Unlike California, we cannot allow any of our local, state, or federal officials to be deceived with any of this "big lie" gun control propaganda. The U.S. has every gun law that could possibly be needed. Virtually every real world scenario of firearm abuse is already covered in some law that is currently on the books. Many of you have inquired as to the outcome of the letter I wrote to Police Chief Bratten of the LAPD. Unfortunately, the chief's position did not change. He continued to use his officers in the same deceptive practices formerly utilized with the city council. These few officers testifying in Sacramento ultimately contributed to the unconstitutional AB50 law being passed. It saddened me to have to tell members of the LAPD SWAT team that they would have to send someone for their rifle, because I refused to assist anyone or any organization that is in violation of the United States Constitution. In turn, the department arranged to pick up their un-serviced rifle. Barrett cannot legally sell any of its products to lawbreakers. Therefore, since California's passing of AB50, the state is not in compliance with the US Constitution's 2nd and 14th Amendments, and we will not sell nor service any of our products to any government agency of the State of California. I appreciate all the phone calls and e-mails from LAPD officers and civilians during that time, encouraging and supporting our actions. We shall see if other firearms companies will follow this path. I know many are corporately owned and feel like they are unable to risk the life of their company for the liberties of our nation, but if we lose our Republic, our freedom, what good is any of it? I am in the proud and fortunate position that many of our forefathers were in when they risked all for our liberties. "Why stand we here idle? What is it that gentlemen wish? What would they have? Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" -Patrick Henry This "ban large bore" insanity failed in Washington years ago, but that didn't discourage the VPC. Now it's resurfacing in city council meetings, in individual states, and it's being reintroduced in Washington. NRA-ILA Executive Director, Chris Cox, once told me "These (anti-freedom, anti-gun) guys never go away, and they never quit." I've received thousands of e-mails and letters from you offering encouragement and support. Our Republic, our liberty, needs and demands your support. You must take action to guard your rights. First, find your State Senator and State Representative. Tell them not to fall for this scam. This lie depends on the elected official being naive about firearms and their capabilities. Stand ready to carry this same message to your U.S. Senator and Representatives. Know all of your elected officials' positions on gun issues. DO NOT ELECT ANY ANTI-GUN PERSON TO ANY POSITION! Position yourself with me in the battles that we must fight. You need to join the NRA, the Fifty Caliber Shooters' Association, and the NSSF in order to stay informed. These people have been with me in the trenches, fighting for every inch of the liberty you enjoy. Today we draw a line; there will be no more nibbling at our freedom. Today you stand idle no longer. Today you do something to save our country! Ronnie Barrett Owner and CEO Barrett Firearms Manufacturing, Inc. www.barrettrifles.com www.nra.org www.fcsa.org www.fiftycal.org www.nssf.org __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Thu Apr 21 15:19:53 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Thu Apr 21 15:22:44 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] El science junko Message-ID: <4267FCD9.6070401@bernstein.providence.ri.us> http://www.genengnews.com/current/article.aspx?cat=Point%20Of%20View&id=323 -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Thu Apr 21 18:37:47 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Thu Apr 21 19:01:51 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Again: who's the victim here? Message-ID: <42682B3B.70803@bernstein.providence.ri.us> "Thousands Attend R.I. Detective's Funeral" http://apnews.myway.com//article/20050421/D89JVN0O0.html Meanwhile various victim lobbies around town have already started their characteristic drumbeats in support of the murderer, e.g. "Insensitivity to the mentally ill!" and "Insensitivity to racial minorities!" Needless to add, the NAACP is at the lead of that parade. It's pretty clear to me what happened, and it doesn't involve mental illness: the murderer had a rap sheet of violent crime, and was going away for a long time for the stabbing of the little old lady (botched purse snatch -- can you believe it?) earlier that night. He decided on the spot he would do what he had to in order to avoid that. He's damn lucky the Providence cops decided to take him in alive. -- Bob Bernstein From mriddle at papillion.ne.us Fri Apr 22 14:14:07 2005 From: mriddle at papillion.ne.us (Mike Riddle) Date: Fri Apr 22 14:17:05 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Passover - JibJab Style Message-ID: <20050422181407.MVAR26223.lakermmtao02.cox.net@enigmaster> ==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== http://www.jibjab.com/matzah/matzah.htm ===================END FORWARDED MESSAGE=================== From spmaiorca at cox.net Fri Apr 22 16:27:33 2005 From: spmaiorca at cox.net (S.P Maiorca) Date: Fri Apr 22 16:30:31 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] would ya'll preview this? Message-ID: <42695E35.2010906@cox.net> Hi I waswondering if I could get some help on this take home unix test? From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Fri Apr 22 18:02:22 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Fri Apr 22 18:04:08 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] would ya'll preview this? In-Reply-To: <42695E35.2010906@cox.net> References: <42695E35.2010906@cox.net> Message-ID: <4269746E.2050809@bernstein.providence.ri.us> S.P Maiorca wrote: > I waswondering if I could get some help on this take home unix test? Did you mean to attach something? -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From dep at linuxandmain.com Sat Apr 23 06:12:31 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Sat Apr 23 06:08:45 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] hmmm Message-ID: <200504230612.31870.dep@linuxandmain.com> well. i have discovered this phenomenon anecdotally, both in myself and in dealing with someone else over the years (for whom the telephone already took priority over anything that wasn't horse-related; it got much worse with the cell phone). even now, if i have an important project its progress depends on my ability to suspend the desire occasionally to "take a break and check email." so there might be something to this, i think: http://www.guardian.co.uk/online/news/0,12597,1465973,00.html Emails 'pose threat to IQ' Martin Wainwright Friday April 22, 2005 The Guardian The distractions of constant emails, text and phone messages are a greater threat to IQ and concentration than taking cannabis, according to a survey of befuddled volunteers. Doziness, lethargy and an increasing inability to focus reached "startling" levels in the trials by 1,100 people, who also demonstrated that emails in particular have an addictive, drug-like grip. Respondents' minds were all over the place as they faced new questions and challenges every time an email dropped into their inbox. Productivity at work was damaged and the effect on staff who could not resist trying to juggle new messages with existing work was the equivalent, over a day, to the loss of a night's sleep. "This is a very real and widespread phenomenon," said Glenn Wilson, a psychiatrist from King's College, London University, who carried out 80 clinical trials for TNS research, commissioned by the IT firm Hewlett Packard. The average IQ loss was measured at 10 points, more than double the four point mean fall found in studies of cannabis users. The most damage was done, according to the survey, by the almost complete lack of discipline in handling emails. Dr Wilson and his colleagues found a compulsion to reply to each new message, leading to constant changes of direction which inevitably tired and slowed down the brain. Manners are also going by the board, with one in five of the respondents breaking off from meals or social engagements to receive and deal with messages. Although nine out of 10 agreed that answering messages during face-to-face meetings or office conferences was rude, a third nonetheless felt that this had become "acceptable and seen as a sign of diligence and efficiency". In fact, it is a recipe for muddled thinking and poor performance, said Dr Wilson, who also called for restraint by the two-thirds of people who check work emails out of office hours and even on holiday. He said: "Companies should encourage a more balanced and appropriate way of working." -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From sjkleinsr at cox.net Sat Apr 23 06:48:59 2005 From: sjkleinsr at cox.net (Stan Klein, Sr.) Date: Sat Apr 23 06:50:32 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] hmmm Message-ID: <20050423104859.RQYI28809.lakermmtao07.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> Matches my experiences, both with e-mail and cell phone. Sitting in Greensboro, NC. Going to Crafton, PA. > > From: dep > > well. i have discovered this phenomenon anecdotally, both in myself and > in dealing with someone else over the years (for whom the telephone > already took priority over anything that wasn't horse-related; it got > much worse with the cell phone). even now, if i have an important > project its progress depends on my ability to suspend the desire > occasionally to "take a break and check email." so there might be > something to this, i think: > Stan Klein, Sr. Being rich is having money; being wealthy is having time. From mriddle at papillion.ne.us Sat Apr 23 13:04:29 2005 From: mriddle at papillion.ne.us (Mike Riddle) Date: Sat Apr 23 13:05:31 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Happy Pesach! Message-ID: <20050423170422.ZZEC11036.lakermmtao01.cox.net@enigmaster> ==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== http://www.shabot6000.com/sedaclub/ ===================END FORWARDED MESSAGE=================== From spmaiorca at cox.net Sat Apr 23 14:04:47 2005 From: spmaiorca at cox.net (S.P Maiorca) Date: Sat Apr 23 14:08:46 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] please review...thanks Message-ID: <426A8E3F.5000100@cox.net> The questions are 4 points each. 1. Briefly describe the vi editor and it's advantages.the vi editor is a text editor that has been around since the 1970's. It is small enugh to fit on a flopy and can be used to edit files on line via dialup connection and uses a memory buffer so changes can be quicly undone and redone. 2. Name and describe the three vi modes. the three modes are command mode the initial default mode used to edit delete and edit lines and munuvor around the document with coursor commands input mode used to enter text accesd by an inseset command like I a or o last line mode used to save and quite accsesd by typeing : while in the command mode 3. Describe each of the following vi commands. a appeneds to text after the curser A sppeneds text at the end of the line i inserts text before the cursor I inserts text at the beginning of a line o opens a new line below the cursor x deletes a character at the cursor dw deletes word or part of a word to the right of the cursor dd deletes the curent line :q! quits with out saving changes :w write buffer save changes and contiue working :wq! save changes and quit 4. Describe each of the following cursor movement keys. j moves down aline k moves up a line h moves left l moves right 5. Describe what each of the following session commads. :set display all variable set :set all shows all variables and there setting :set showmode turns off dissplay mode :set nu shows line numbers 6. Briefly describe the EMACS editor and it's advantages. EMACS is a free open source text editor developed my Rishard Stallman during the 1980's while he was onstaff at MIT. It featrues help for every key stroke modules for prgraming languages like C++ and fortran and is built around it's onw cpmmand interpriter for a language called elisp. EMACS ios available for bractly every operating system and CPU. 7. Briefly describe the Pico editor and it's advantages. the Pico editor is a text editor that uses the mouse to move the cursor and keyboad comands for things like opening files cuting and pasting. 8. Name and describe the nine Security Policy Componenets. a Physical security involves loking down computers and restricting physical access and security cameras to prevent a computer from being stolen or damaged or to see some one who is trying to steal one or that damage can not occure to other physical means like a fire. b. Login Security a login requierment that sets complexity like numbers letters caps and the amount of time a password can last before it has to change and the amount of changes before a password can be resued. c. file security permisions to restrict acccess from un otherised users d. virus protection having a virus scanner to screen for possible viruses as most viri attack windows this is more important if you have windows clients. e. remote access configuring of remote acces polices to ensure that unathrorised acess is not given and network security holes are pluged. f. firewalls- have a file wall in place to restrict unused ports. g backups- maintain a good back up schedual so that if the server goes down you won't lose more than a day or two depending on how often vital data gets updated. h. disater recovery plan ensure that a plan exists so that when distater strikes the network down time in minimosed this may enclude having two servers in difrent location storing back up tapes in a bank safty depostit box j. audits-rutinlty probe your network and facility to look for weaknesses and harden them. 10. Name and describe the four Standard UNIX Security Features. a. useracounts - the main role of a usser account is to restrict acsess for example standered users from accessing any file that is not in their home directory or the root user has not given them acces to nor can they modify the system settings. b, remote acess security toolsfire walls and tools like iptable or ipchain that can be used to restrict ip adresses that can acess the computer. fore example an accounting computer might only be accessable by an internal machine in the 192.1.0.0 network c. security tools like satan and aset and tripwire can be used to monoter who gets access and weaknesses on a computer or network. d. file security file permisons are designed to limit who has acces to a file. 11. Name and describe each column of outpupt of the ls -l command. The ls -l command gives the following information file type permissions links owner group size last date in time modified file name an example would be - rw-r-r 1 b.hope road 51 feb 10 12:05 cros 12. Describe, explain and give an example of the chmod command. the change mod comand changes the permissions for a given file for exsample chmod 777 public.txt changes it so every one gets permission to the file while 643 changes so the owner can read write and exicute the group can read and every one else can write and exicute 13. Describe, explain and give an example of the chown command. chown changes owner chown bob hamlet.txt would assign bob ownership of the file 14. Describe, explain and give an example of the chgrp command. changes group ownership like chgrp programers heloworld.c would change heloworld from a group called programers 15. What is ASET? automated security enhancement tool a tool that views setings like file permissions and other system setings and recommends fixes to improve secutity 16. What is SATAN? security administrators tool for analizing networks is a tool that dose a port scan on a computer on a network to look for weaknesses 17. Name and describe the three main components of the UNIX Printing Environment. The components of the unix printing enviroment are teh Printer which is the physical device and not an abstract concept like it is in a windows envrionment. the Printer name which is the logical ID of the printer Print server the computer that manages the printing operations by managing incoming and relaising out going print requests. 18. Describe, explain and give an eample of the following print commands. lp submits a print request like lp ~ ./listfile prints a file called list file lpstat give the status of a printer like lpstat printer3 give the stats for printer 3 cancel cancles a print job like cancel listfile.txt cancles the printing of list file. and canel -u k.maiorca kills cncles printing for the user k.maiorca 19. Name and describe five reasons for lost or corrupted data. a. improper shutdown b. magnetic fields c. media going bad d. viri or other attacks e. accedtinel or intentional deletion of important files 20. Describe and explain full, incremental and differential backups. The three types of back up are ful which backs up every thing on the system a difrental backs up every thing that has changed since the last full backup while a incremental will back up data that has changed since the last full or incremental back up. 21. What is a RAID? redundint areay of inexpnisive disk a technique used to add more space speed and data security by using multiple disks. The three main forms of raid are raid 0 or non paraty stripping which is used purly for speed as a stripe of data gets written across multiple drives speeding up the data transfer rate. RAID 1 or mirrioring where the exact same data is written to two drives so if one fails the other takes over. The final is raid 5 which uses three or more drives with data being stripped on drive 0 and 1 and drive 2 being used as a parity check. 22. Describe, explain and give an example of the tar command. tar is an archiving utility which can be sued to bundle a back up of a file or group of files like tar cf backup.tar /home/user1 backs up every thing in a user's dirctory 23. Describe, explain and give an example of the cpio command cpio. cpio stands for copy in-out and copies a group of files from the output of an other command like find or ls for exsample ls | cpio -ov > /dev/fd0 copies a directory to a floppy 24. Describe and explain file compression. file compression utilities like zip which is used by typing zip book chap* will either look for patterns such arepeated names and replace it with a single charicter or dump information like available colors in a video or .jpg 25. Describe and explain how to format a Linux floppy disk. a floppy can be formated with a gui utility like the gnome floppy formater or the command line like fdformat /dev/fd0 From daniel.lee.kruse at gmail.com Sat Apr 23 14:44:43 2005 From: daniel.lee.kruse at gmail.com (Daniel Kruse) Date: Sat Apr 23 14:46:34 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Happy Pesach! In-Reply-To: <20050423170422.ZZEC11036.lakermmtao01.cox.net@enigmaster> References: <20050423170422.ZZEC11036.lakermmtao01.cox.net@enigmaster> Message-ID: <46d72e00050423114465d1e2d9@mail.gmail.com> Forgive my ignorance, but what is Pesach? Daniel Lee Kruse On 4/23/05, Mike Riddle wrote: > ==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== > > http://www.shabot6000.com/sedaclub/ > > ===================END FORWARDED MESSAGE=================== > > _______________________________________________ > os2-right-stuff-l mailing list > os2-right-stuff-l@jtan.com > http://mailman.jtan.com/mailman/listinfo/os2-right-stuff-l > From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Sat Apr 23 15:02:16 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Sat Apr 23 15:06:41 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Happy Pesach! In-Reply-To: <46d72e00050423114465d1e2d9@mail.gmail.com> References: <20050423170422.ZZEC11036.lakermmtao01.cox.net@enigmaster> <46d72e00050423114465d1e2d9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <426A9BB8.4070205@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Daniel Kruse wrote: > Forgive my ignorance, but what is Pesach? http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=pesach&btnG=Google+Search :-) -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From prather.js at verizon.net Sat Apr 23 16:53:35 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Sat Apr 23 16:54:41 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] I don't get it. In-Reply-To: <4264246E.2030009@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <0IFF00GPJ3DCC8X2@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 17:19:42 -0400, Bob Bernstein wrote: >_______________________________________________ >os2-right-stuff-l mailing list >os2-right-stuff-l@jtan.com >http://mailman.jtan.com/mailman/listinfo/os2-right-stuff-l > I don't get it either, Bob. You've gone into an incompatible mode again. Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From dep at linuxandmain.com Sat Apr 23 16:58:37 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Sat Apr 23 16:55:04 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] please review...thanks In-Reply-To: <426A8E3F.5000100@cox.net> References: <426A8E3F.5000100@cox.net> Message-ID: <200504231658.37344.dep@linuxandmain.com> quoth S.P Maiorca: | The questions are 4 points each. | | 1. Briefly describe the vi editor and it's advantages.the vi editor | is a text editor that has been around since the 1970's. It is small | enugh to fit on a flopy and can be used to edit files on line via | dialup connection and uses a memory buffer so changes can be quicly | undone and redone. vi is, yes, said to be an editor. its chief purpose, though, is in making new friends by posting a message to any unix newsgroup or mailing list with the subject "vi or emacs?" and, for special warmth in those friendships, expressing a preference for one over the other in the body of the message. for editing, use the editor in midnight commander. | 2. Name and describe the three vi modes. | the three modes are | command mode the initial default mode used to edit delete and edit | lines and munuvor around the document with coursor commands | input mode used to enter text accesd by an inseset command like I a | or o last line mode used to save and quite accsesd by typeing : while | in the command mode 1. possible: you can get this far with less than a week's training. 2. maybe possible: people who use their real names claim to have done it. 3. impossible: it's documented, but the rosetta stone for the documentation has not been located. | 3. Describe each of the following vi commands. | | a appeneds to text after the curser | A sppeneds text at the end of the line | i inserts text before the cursor | I inserts text at the beginning of a line | o opens a new line below the cursor | x deletes a character at the cursor | dw deletes word or part of a word to the right of the cursor | dd deletes the curent line alternately, a prints the letter a to the screen; A prints a capital a to the screen, and so on. this happens, however, only when you wish the letter to be a command; when you wish to execute the command the letter prints to the screen instead. | | :q! quits with out saving changes | :w write buffer save changes and contiue working | :wq! save changes and quit or prints ":q!" "w" or ":wq!" to the screen. see above. | 4. Describe each of the following cursor movement keys. | | j moves down aline | k moves up a line | h moves left | l moves right same principal as with other commands applies. | | 5. Describe what each of the following session commads. | | :set display all variable set | :set all shows all variables and there setting | :set showmode turns off dissplay mode | :set nu shows line numbers this works only a small percentage of time, which has led to the time-honored remark said in amazement to those who actually make it work: "you have some :set." | 6. Briefly describe the EMACS editor and it's advantages. | EMACS is a free open source text editor developed my Rishard Stallman | during the 1980's while he was onstaff at MIT. It featrues help for | every key stroke modules for prgraming languages like C++ and fortran | and is built around it's onw cpmmand interpriter for a language | called elisp. | EMACS ios available for bractly every operating system and CPU. the chief advantage of emacs is that it in not vi (even as the chief advantage of vi is that it is not emacs). it was written by stallman in an effort to produce a text editor capable of washing your car through add-ons. its chief disadvantage is that it is easier to wash your car by hand than it is to figure out how to get emacs to do it. | 7. Briefly describe the Pico editor and it's advantages. the Pico | editor is a text editor that uses the mouse to move the cursor and | keyboad comands for things like opening files cuting and pasting. (serious answer) it also uses the cursor keys to move the cursor. it is deemed impure by many in the free software world, in that it comes with the same license as the pine mailer. one major advantage of it is that it was long the default editor for many bulletin-board systems, so many, many people are familiar with it. -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From mriddle at oasis.novia.net Sat Apr 23 17:03:37 2005 From: mriddle at oasis.novia.net (Mike Riddle) Date: Sat Apr 23 17:04:37 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] please review...thanks In-Reply-To: <200504231658.37344.dep@linuxandmain.com> Message-ID: <200504232103.j3NL3aC7003439@oasis.novia.net> On Sat, 23 Apr 2005 16:58:37 -0400, dep wrote: >vi is, yes, said to be an editor. its chief purpose, though, is in >making new friends by posting a message to any unix newsgroup or >mailing list with the subject "vi or emacs?" and, for special warmth in >those friendships, expressing a preference for one over the other in >the body of the message. for editing, use the editor in midnight >commander. Naw. Real Unixmen (and women) use ed. From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Sat Apr 23 19:01:52 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Sat Apr 23 19:03:37 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] I don't get it. In-Reply-To: <0IFF00GPJ3DCC8X2@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0IFF00GPJ3DCC8X2@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <426AD3E0.6070809@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Jerry Prather wrote: > I don't get it either, Bob. You've gone into an incompatible > mode again. Perhaps by virtue of adding a digital sig? -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From mriddle at oasis.novia.net Sat Apr 23 20:37:25 2005 From: mriddle at oasis.novia.net (Mike Riddle) Date: Sat Apr 23 20:38:45 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] I don't get it. In-Reply-To: <426AD3E0.6070809@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <200504240037.j3O0bPSh020726@oasis.novia.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Sat, 23 Apr 2005 19:01:52 -0400, Bob Bernstein wrote: >Jerry Prather wrote: >> I don't get it either, Bob. You've gone into an incompatible >> mode again. >Perhaps by virtue of adding a digital sig? Yup. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGP SDK 3.0.3 iQA/AwUBQmrqRf5P0IDbNy34EQI/2wCg1zMhROfWvAfNjOi4qsnxuiv+cW4AnRb9 DaGrK+zIZPusxxfRuuVjgriQ =JbDg -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Sat Apr 23 20:46:40 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Sat Apr 23 20:47:42 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] I don't get it. In-Reply-To: <200504240037.j3O0bPSh020726@oasis.novia.net> References: <200504240037.j3O0bPSh020726@oasis.novia.net> Message-ID: <426AEC70.10209@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Mike Riddle wrote: >>>Perhaps by virtue of adding a digital sig? > Yup. Ok! -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 253 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature Url : http://mailman.jtan.com/pipermail/os2-right-stuff-l/attachments/20050423/3247ec88/signature.bin From mriddle at oasis.novia.net Sat Apr 23 21:48:17 2005 From: mriddle at oasis.novia.net (Mike Riddle) Date: Sat Apr 23 21:48:56 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] I don't get it. In-Reply-To: <426AEC70.10209@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <200504240148.j3O1mHvN028962@oasis.novia.net> On Sat, 23 Apr 2005 20:46:40 -0400, Bob Bernstein wrote: >Mike Riddle wrote: >>>>Perhaps by virtue of adding a digital sig? >> Yup. >Ok! The above exchange was physically within the message you sent; however, it did not display when opened in PMMail--and apparently not in several other mailers, or we wouldn't be having this conversation. I "found" it when I asked PMMail to show me the full message: headers, footers, formatting codes, etc. My specualtion is that your >User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (X11/20050324) is not setting the MIME part boundaries correctly. It looks to me like the separator: "--------------enig7156D7C4ADE27330A92ECF5C" is used twice. That might explain why opening the message in a normal fashion shows only the list footer and an "unnamed attachment." The rest of the analysis is left to someone who knows message formats better than I do. It also occurs to me that the GPG/Thunderbird interface may need some considerable tweaking. Mike The entire body of your message to which I am replying is quoted below: >This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) >--===============1782505467== >Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; >protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------ >enig7156D7C4ADE27330A92ECF5C" >This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) >--------------enig7156D7C4ADE27330A92ECF5C >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >Mike Riddle wrote: >>>>Perhaps by virtue of adding a digital sig? >> Yup. >Ok! >-- >Bob Bernstein > What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and > "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" > occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? > > P.W. Bridgman (1955) > >--------------enig7156D7C4ADE27330A92ECF5C >Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" >Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature >Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- >Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (NetBSD) >Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org >iD8DBQFCaux4y6FzE5/Ay1oRAnkCAKCh8iDgHNr0aMoVzz7zpqkeChvqqwCfYSOy >MkN39XNuBISG+13B59KdVAY= >=KReg >-----END PGP SIGNATURE----- >--------------enig7156D7C4ADE27330A92ECF5C-- >--===============1782505467== >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >MIME-Version: 1.0 >Content-Disposition: inline >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >_______________________________________________ >os2-right-stuff-l mailing list >os2-right-stuff-l@jtan.com >http://mailman.jtan.com/mailman/listinfo/os2-right-stuff-l >--===============1782505467==-- From prather.js at verizon.net Sat Apr 23 21:14:58 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Sat Apr 23 22:15:46 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Reporting back... Message-ID: <0IFF005NZFGYNY03@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> Sorry, but I've been away for a week -- and put a thousand miles on the car. (This Intrepid runs well getting 28 mpg at 70-80 mph.) We had gone to Raleigh last Saturday with the intention of attending a friend's ordination on Sunday. On Sunday morning we got a phone call which reported that Barbara's mother had been taken to the hospital with 104 degree fever from pneumonia and an urinary tract infection. We skipped the ordination (giving proper apologies) and made a run back to Virginia Beach to repack. On Monday, we made a straight trip to Jesup (GA) to find her mother modestly improved. Over the next couple of days she continued to improved until the doctor said we could/should leave on Friday. [As an aside, this is a gorgeous time of year in southeast Georgia. The temperature rises from the sixties into the eighties during the course of the day, and the humidity is still low. Even the bug count is low.] Mrs. Blalock is still in the hospital, but improving steadily, if gradually. We came back via Matthews, NC where we did an overnight with my father (94 years old as of March). He and I are planning a cruise in the Baltic and the Norwegian coast this August. So that's why I've been a bit silent. Now, after I dig through the backlog of some 500 e-mails, I might be available to comment on other things... Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From poobah at ruptured-duck.com Sat Apr 23 23:51:44 2005 From: poobah at ruptured-duck.com (Bob Bernstein) Date: Sat Apr 23 23:53:03 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] I don't get it. In-Reply-To: <200504240148.j3O1mHvN028962@oasis.novia.net> References: <426AEC70.10209@bernstein.providence.ri.us> <200504240148.j3O1mHvN028962@oasis.novia.net> Message-ID: <20050424035144.GB21102@callisto.jtan.com> On Sat, Apr 23, 2005 at 08:48:17PM -0500, Mike Riddle wrote: > My specualtion is that your > > >User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (X11/20050324) > > is not setting the MIME part boundaries correctly. Any better now? This is mutt, running on another machine. -- Bob Bernstein And what rough beast, its hour come round at last, Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born? -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 187 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.jtan.com/pipermail/os2-right-stuff-l/attachments/20050423/2d7bf3e6/attachment.bin From daniel.lee.kruse at gmail.com Sun Apr 24 00:32:28 2005 From: daniel.lee.kruse at gmail.com (Daniel Kruse) Date: Sun Apr 24 00:33:47 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Happy Pesach! In-Reply-To: <426A9BB8.4070205@bernstein.providence.ri.us> References: <20050423170422.ZZEC11036.lakermmtao01.cox.net@enigmaster> <46d72e00050423114465d1e2d9@mail.gmail.com> <426A9BB8.4070205@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <46d72e0005042321323a1ea2b@mail.gmail.com> Thank you all for educating me. Time to learn more Hebrew, I guess. :-) On 4/23/05, Bob Bernstein wrote: > Daniel Kruse wrote: From dep at linuxandmain.com Sun Apr 24 05:18:53 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Sun Apr 24 05:14:56 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Reporting back... In-Reply-To: <0IFF005NZFGYNY03@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0IFF005NZFGYNY03@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <200504240518.53846.dep@linuxandmain.com> quoth Jerry Prather: | (This Intrepid runs well getting 28 mpg at 70-80 | mph.) making it seem all the more foolish for them to mothball her and make a museum of her. it is good to hear that barbara's mother is on the mend. as to the continued travels of you and your father -- well, talk about *intrepid*! -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From mriddle at oasis.novia.net Sun Apr 24 07:39:21 2005 From: mriddle at oasis.novia.net (Mike Riddle) Date: Sun Apr 24 07:39:59 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] I don't get it. In-Reply-To: <20050424035144.GB21102@callisto.jtan.com> Message-ID: <200504241139.j3OBdMFD000966@oasis.novia.net> On Sat, 23 Apr 2005 23:51:44 -0400, Bob Bernstein wrote: >On Sat, Apr 23, 2005 at 08:48:17PM -0500, Mike Riddle wrote: >> My specualtion is that your=20 >>=20 >> >User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (X11/20050324) >>=20 >> is not setting the MIME part boundaries correctly. >Any better now? This is mutt, running on another machine. Nope. Same symptom: empty message, unnamed attachment, when the entire message is viewed, voila!. From prather.js at verizon.net Sun Apr 24 09:53:21 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Sun Apr 24 09:58:51 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] I don't get it. In-Reply-To: <200504241139.j3OBdMFD000966@oasis.novia.net> Message-ID: <0IFG00GF8EKXK5C8@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> On Sun, 24 Apr 2005 06:39:21 -0500, Mike Riddle wrote: >Nope. > >Same symptom: empty message, unnamed attachment, when the entire >message is viewed, voila!. I see the same thing here. Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From daniel.lee.kruse at gmail.com Sun Apr 24 10:02:25 2005 From: daniel.lee.kruse at gmail.com (Daniel Kruse) Date: Sun Apr 24 10:04:02 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Reporting back... In-Reply-To: <200504240518.53846.dep@linuxandmain.com> References: <0IFF005NZFGYNY03@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> <200504240518.53846.dep@linuxandmain.com> Message-ID: <46d72e0005042407024ece3ee9@mail.gmail.com> On 4/24/05, dep wrote: > quoth Jerry Prather: > | (This Intrepid runs well getting 28 mpg at 70-80 > | mph.) The Intrepid is getting mothballed? When was this announced? It seems like a decent car. Later, Daniel Lee Kruse > > making it seem all the more foolish for them to mothball her and make a > museum of her. > > -- > dep > > The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists > have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. > -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" > _______________________________________________ > os2-right-stuff-l mailing list > os2-right-stuff-l@jtan.com > http://mailman.jtan.com/mailman/listinfo/os2-right-stuff-l > From prather.js at verizon.net Sun Apr 24 10:26:53 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Sun Apr 24 10:27:57 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Reporting back... In-Reply-To: <46d72e0005042407024ece3ee9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <0IFG009Z2G4SKA82@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> On Sun, 24 Apr 2005 09:02:25 -0500, Daniel Kruse wrote: >The Intrepid is getting mothballed? When was this announced? It >seems like a decent car. The '04 model was the last. It is being replaced by a new model called the Charger which appears to be the same chassis as the Chrysler 300. I have both a '95 and an '02 Intrepid, both with 3.5 L 6 cylinder engines, and love them both. I have no idea how I would replace them as I don't see a real equivalent for size, trunk space, etc. Somehow I can't see me in a Cadillac or a Lincoln. A Camry or Lexus, maybe? Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From dep at linuxandmain.com Sun Apr 24 19:36:59 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Sun Apr 24 19:33:08 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] possibly the best obituary ever written Message-ID: <200504241936.59791.dep@linuxandmain.com> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/04/21/db2101.xml&sSheet=/portal/2005/04/21/ixportal.html my favorite sentence: "In 1999 he had begun a relationship with Nathalie Lions, a pneumatic 29-year-old whom he had met in a lingerie shop in Geneva, where she was working as a model." pneumatic! anyway, here it is: The Earl of Shaftesbury (Filed: 21/04/2005) The 10th Earl of Shaftesbury, whose death aged 66 was confirmed yesterday, demonstrated the dangers of the possession of inherited wealth coupled with a weakness for women and Champagne. Shaftesbury, who disappeared last November prompting an international police investigation, was tall, debonair, affable and rather shy. He tried after his own fashion to be true to the liberal philanthropic family traditions of his ancestors, notably the first Earl (1621-83), founder of the Whig party in Parliament, and the 7th Earl (1801-85), the great 19th-century evangelical social reformer. He served as president of the Shaftesbury Society, which the 7th Earl had founded, and - as a keen music fan - was chairman of the London Philharmonic Orchestra from 1966 to 1980. He was also respected as a conservationist. On his 9,000-acre estate at Wimborne St Giles, Dorset, he planted more than a million trees and, in 1992, was joint winner of the Royal Forestry Society's National Duke of Cornwall's Award for Forestry and Conservation. He also served as president of the Hawk and Owl Trust and as vice-president of the British Butterfly Conservation Society. It was said, after his mysterious disappearance from a Cannes nightclub, that the 10th Earl, like Gladstone, had been devoting himself to helping vulnerable young girls working in nightspots on the French Riviera to start new lives. But as the mystery deepened, it seemed that his interest was more than merely philanthropic. Indeed, Lord Shaftesbury had always exhibited a weakness for exotic women. At Eton he had famously penned an article for the college magazine in which he described English debutantes as "round-shouldered, unsophisticated garglers of pink champagne". His subsequent amorous career was notable for his avoidance of the species. He met his Italian-born first wife, Bianca Le Vien, the ex-wife of an American film producer and 12 years his senior, during a skiing holiday. They married in 1966, but divorced, owing to his adultery with an unnamed woman, in 1976. The same year he married a Swedish-born divorcee, Christina Casella, the daughter of a diplomat, with whom he had two sons. That marriage, too, ended acrimoniously, in 2000, and he embarked on a string of short-lived and expensive love affairs with younger women distinguished by their exotic looks and equally colourful past histories. He became a familiar figure in some of the loucher nightspots on the French Riviera, where he cut a curious figure in leather trousers, pink shirts and large red-and-black spectacles; he was notable for his habit of flashing his money around as he bought drinks for a succession of nubile female companions. In 1999 he had begun a relationship with Nathalie Lions, a pneumatic 29-year-old whom he had met in a lingerie shop in Geneva, where she was working as a model. They became engaged, and he paraded her around London, Barbados and the south of France, maintaining that she was a member of the Italian royal house of Savoy. He admitted to lavishing some ?1 million on her in cheques and expensive gifts, including a ?100,000 Rolex watch and an Audi TT sports car. But their relationship came to an end in 2002 after it was revealed that she was, in fact, a French nude model and former Penthouse "Pet" with silicone-enhanced breasts. Later that year, he married Jamila M'Barek, a Tunisian divorcee with two children, whom he had met in a Paris bar where she was working as a hostess. She separated from him in April 2004, claiming that he had become an alcoholic and "sex addict", regularly overdosing on Viagra and having testosterone injections. Among several bizarre stories, she alleged that, on one occasion, she had returned unexpectedly to their flat in Cannes to find her husband in the company of a large Arab gangster and two Arab women who were rifling through the wardrobes. Her husband was on a stool singing and dancing; the women left with a car-load of her belongings. In August 2004 Shaftesbury was reported as having taken up with a 33-year old Moroccan hostess known as Nadia. He installed her and her two children in their own flat and, a month later, asked her to become the fourth Countess of Shaftesbury. On the evening of November 5 2004, Shaftesbury left the Noga Hilton Hotel in Cannes and, as was his regular habit by this time, entered a basement hostess-bar nearby. Within 24 hours he had vanished, setting off an international criminal investigation. The saga of "le Lord disparu" sent the French media into a frenzy, and spawned a multitude of theories. In February his estranged wife, Jamila M'Barek, was arrested by French police and allegedly admitted that she was present when the Earl was killed in her home; but she insisted that she was only a witness to a fight involving her husband and his killer. She and her brother Mohammed have both been placed under investigation for murder, which is a step short of formal charges under French law. Anthony Ashley-Cooper was born on May 22 1938, the elder son of Major Lord Ashley, elder son of the 9th Earl of Shaftesbury KP, PC, GCVO, CBE. Lord Ashley, who died in 1947 before he could inherit the earldom, had shocked London society by marrying the model and chorus girl Sylvia Hawkes. After their divorce she went on to marry Douglas Fairbanks Sr, followed by Clark Gable. Anthony was the son of his father's French-born second wife, Fran?oise Soulier. He was educated at Eton and at Christ Church, Oxford, and, as a young man, was a keen climber and skier. He succeeded to the earldom aged 22 on his grandfather's death in 1961. The 9th Earl had, by prudent financial planning, arranged matters so that his heirs would avoid death duties. The young earl therefore came into an estate which included the family's 17th-century home and large estate in Dorset, several other properties and a collection of art and other valuables. By the 1990s his wealth was said to be in the "low millions". It was another ancestor, the 3rd Earl, who had bequeathed to his wayward descendant the wisest counsel: "The extending of a single passion too far or the continuance of it too long," he observed, "is able to bring irrecoverable ruin and misery." Shaftesbury's body was found in the south of France on April 5; yesterday it was announced that DNA tests had confirmed his identity. By his second marriage, Lord Shaftesbury had two sons, the eldest of whom, Anthony Nils Christian, Lord Ashley, born in 1977, succeeds to the earldom. -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From prather.js at verizon.net Sun Apr 24 19:52:31 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Sun Apr 24 19:54:02 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] possibly the best obituary ever written In-Reply-To: <200504241936.59791.dep@linuxandmain.com> Message-ID: <0IFH00M8V6BKIH2C@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> On Sun, 24 Apr 2005 19:36:59 -0400, dep wrote: >pneumatic! Ah! A word well remembered from "Brave New World"! And such an obituary should be posted in Playboy magazine. Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From daniel.lee.kruse at gmail.com Sun Apr 24 20:33:39 2005 From: daniel.lee.kruse at gmail.com (Daniel Kruse) Date: Sun Apr 24 20:35:03 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Reporting back... In-Reply-To: <0IFG009Z2G4SKA82@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> References: <46d72e0005042407024ece3ee9@mail.gmail.com> <0IFG009Z2G4SKA82@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <46d72e000504241733276c676f@mail.gmail.com> On 4/24/05, Jerry Prather wrote: > On Sun, 24 Apr 2005 09:02:25 -0500, Daniel Kruse wrote: > > > The '04 model was the last. It is being replaced by a new model > called the Charger which appears to be the same chassis as the > Chrysler 300. > > I have both a '95 and an '02 Intrepid, both with 3.5 L 6 > cylinder engines, and love them both. I have no idea how I > would replace them as I don't see a real equivalent for size, > trunk space, etc. Somehow I can't see me in a Cadillac or a > Lincoln. A Camry or Lexus, maybe? The Chrysler 300 appears to be a nice vehicle. Why not consider it? I had heard the Charger was being brought back. But as an Intrepid replacement? I thought the Charger was more of a muscle/sports car than a standard car. Daniel Lee Kruse > > Jerry From prather.js at verizon.net Sun Apr 24 21:03:04 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Sun Apr 24 21:04:09 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Reporting back... In-Reply-To: <46d72e000504241733276c676f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <0IFH00A2G9L4ZA66@vms040.mailsrvcs.net> On Sun, 24 Apr 2005 19:33:39 -0500, Daniel Kruse wrote: >The Chrysler 300 appears to be a nice vehicle. Why not consider it? > >I had heard the Charger was being brought back. But as an Intrepid >replacement? I thought the Charger was more of a muscle/sports car >than a standard car. As near as I can tell, both of these points go hand in hand. The key is the same chassis and engine choices between the Chrysler and the Dodge brands. Both of these cars are BIG muscle cars when you put the hemi V-8 engine in them. I've been very satisfied with the power provided by the 3.5 V-6 in my Intrepids. One thing that I have not done is to actually go out and sit in one of these newer DC machines. My "impression" is that the car is shorter, higher, and narrower than my Intrepids. The trunk of my '02 is cavernous, and I can't imagine how that size trunk would ever fit on the 300/Charger chassis. But until I go try one on, I can't make any final judgements. On the other hand, maybe I'm just old enough that I have to buy a Buick. (Blecch). Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Sun Apr 24 21:16:25 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Sun Apr 24 21:17:08 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Reporting back... In-Reply-To: <0IFH00A2G9L4ZA66@vms040.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0IFH00A2G9L4ZA66@vms040.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <426C44E9.10205@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Jerry Prather wrote: > Both of these cars are BIG muscle cars when you put the hemi V-8 > engine in them. I've been very satisfied with the power provided by > the 3.5 V-6 in my Intrepids. What I wouldn't give to have my '68 slant-six Dart back! Three-on-the-column!! Woo-hoo!!! -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From mriddle at oasis.novia.net Sun Apr 24 22:08:40 2005 From: mriddle at oasis.novia.net (Mike Riddle) Date: Sun Apr 24 22:10:05 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Reporting back... In-Reply-To: <426C44E9.10205@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <200504250208.j3P28e1H016345@oasis.novia.net> On Sun, 24 Apr 2005 21:16:25 -0400, Bob Bernstein wrote: >> Both of these cars are BIG muscle cars when you put the hemi V-8 >> engine in them. I've been very satisfied with the power provided by >> the 3.5 V-6 in my Intrepids. >What I wouldn't give to have my '68 slant-six Dart back! Push-button transmission? ;-) From m.o.davis at gte.net Sun Apr 24 22:38:20 2005 From: m.o.davis at gte.net (Davis Mark) Date: Sun Apr 24 22:39:11 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Cars [Was: Reporting back...] In-Reply-To: <426C44E9.10205@bernstein.providence.ri.us> References: <0IFH00A2G9L4ZA66@vms040.mailsrvcs.net> <426C44E9.10205@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <11438a7d514433b9cc24ad9d1d931a28@gte.net> On Apr 24, 2005, at 8:16 PM, Bob Bernstein wrote: > Jerry Prather wrote: > >> Both of these cars are BIG muscle cars when you put the hemi V-8 >> engine in them. I've been very satisfied with the power provided by >> the 3.5 V-6 in my Intrepids. > > What I wouldn't give to have my '68 slant-six Dart back! > > Three-on-the-column!! > > Woo-hoo!!! I have fond memories of most the cars our family had in the 1960's: the '57 Ford Fairlane in which we rode to school (rusted out floorboards, my older brother driving, 3 on column), the '62 Plymouth Valiant slant 6 my daddy bought used from my mother's boss (3 on floor), my mother's '63 Dodge station wagon with the 383 V8 and Vegamatic transmission controls (I got it up to 80 in second gear once), the '65 Toyota Land Cruiser soft top that I was privileged to drive to high school for a year and my parents still use every year when they go to Colorado for the summer (3 on column), my daddy's '67 Falcon with the 289 V8 and 3 on the column (I used to lay rubber in front of my girlfriend's house after we had a fight; so satisfying!) and the '69 Dodge Monaco (great makeout car). But my favorite car I've ever driven is the original Dodge/Plymouth minivan. I bought one in 1984, the year they came out, and another in 1991. As soon as the kids are gone, I'm getting rid of the Suburban and getting another minivan. -- Mark Davis San Angelo, TX From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Sun Apr 24 23:33:57 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Sun Apr 24 23:35:06 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Cars [Was: Reporting back...] In-Reply-To: <11438a7d514433b9cc24ad9d1d931a28@gte.net> References: <0IFH00A2G9L4ZA66@vms040.mailsrvcs.net> <426C44E9.10205@bernstein.providence.ri.us> <11438a7d514433b9cc24ad9d1d931a28@gte.net> Message-ID: <426C6525.4050005@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Davis Mark wrote: > I used to lay rubber in front of my girlfriend's house after we had a > fight; so satisfying! You showed her _just_ who [whom?] she was dealing with, huh? -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Sun Apr 24 23:37:04 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Sun Apr 24 23:38:07 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Reporting back... In-Reply-To: <200504250208.j3P28e1H016345@oasis.novia.net> References: <200504250208.j3P28e1H016345@oasis.novia.net> Message-ID: <426C65E0.6030601@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Mike Riddle wrote: > Push-button transmission? Sounds like you have some fond memories back there, but, no, alas, and as noted, three-on-the-column. My father did have a ('58 ?) push-button DeSoto iirc, but I was too young to get my mitts on that one. He was one of those guys who for years would only countenance Chrysler products. -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From prather.js at verizon.net Mon Apr 25 08:53:01 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Mon Apr 25 08:54:21 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Cars [Was: Reporting back...] In-Reply-To: <11438a7d514433b9cc24ad9d1d931a28@gte.net> Message-ID: <0IFI00G0Q6GEC2G6@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> On Sun, 24 Apr 2005 21:38:20 -0500, Davis Mark wrote: >'63 Dodge station wagon with the 383 V8 They were still using that engine in 1970. I got it in a Plymouth Suburban station wagon and it handled the weight of that car just fine. In my '77 Dodge station wagon they had drilled out the 383 to a 400, but the snappy performance was lacking due to all the anti-pollution junk hung on it. My favorite in terms of quickness was my 1968 Barracuda fast back with the 340-S engine with dual 4 barrel carbs, dual exhaust and twin cams. It had an automatic transmission, but you still had to be careful when pressing the accelerator from a stop light or you'd squeal the tires. They advertised that engine at 340 hp - one horse per cubic inch! Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From rluchor at yahoo.com Mon Apr 25 08:24:09 2005 From: rluchor at yahoo.com (Rich Luchor) Date: Mon Apr 25 09:05:33 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Comments? Message-ID: <20050425122409.69428.qmail@web31514.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I received this from a liberal GWB hater: ------------------------------------------ The Lovenstein Institute of Scranton Pennsylvania think tank includes high caliber historians, psychiatrists, sociologists, scientists in human behavior, and psychologists. Among their ranks are Dr. Werner R. Lovenstein, world-renowned sociologist, and Professor Patricia F. Dilliams, a world-respected psychiatrist. This study was commissioned on February 13, 2001 and released on July 9, 2001 to subscribing member universities and organizations within the education community. The study determined the following IQs of each president as accurate to within five percentage points: 147 Franklin D. Roosevelt (D) 132 Harry Truman (D) 122 Dwight D. Eisenhower (R) 174 John F. Kennedy (D) 126 Lyndon B. Johnson (D) 155 Richard M. Nixon (R) 121 Gerald Ford (R) 175 James E. Carter (D) 105 Ronald Reagan (R) 098 George HW Bush (R) 182 William J. Clinton (D) 091 George W. Bush (R) The six Republican presidents of the past 50 years had an average IQ of 115.5, with President Nixon having the highest IQ, at 155. President G. W. Bush was rated the lowest of all the Republicans with an IQ of 91. The six Democrat presidents had IQs with an average of 156, with President Clinton having the highest IQ, at 182. President Lyndon B. Johnson was rated the lowest of all the Democrats with an IQ of 126. No president other than Carter (D) has released his actual IQ, 176. Among comments made concerning the specific testing of President GW Bush, his low ratings were due to his apparent difficulty to command the English language in public statements, his limited use of vocabulary (6,500 words for Bush versus an average of 11,000 words for other presidents), his lack of scholarly achievements other than a basic MBA, and an absence of any body of work which could be studied on an intellectual basis. The complete report documents the methods and procedures used to arrive at these ratings, including depth of sentence structure and voice stress confidence analysis. "All the Presidents prior to George W. Bush had a least one book under their belt, and most had written several white papers during their education or early careers. Not so with President Bush," Dr. Lovenstein said. "He has no published works or writings, so in many ways that made it more difficult to arrive at an assessment. We had to rely more heavily on transcripts of his unscripted public speaking." The Lovenstein Institute of Scranton Pennsylvania think tank includes high caliber historians, psychiatrists, sociologists, scientists in human behavior, and psychologists. Among their ranks are Dr. Werner R. Lovenstein, world-renowned sociologist, and Professor Patricia F. Dilliams, a world-respected psychiatrist. This study was commissioned on February 13, 2001 and released on July 9, 2001 to subscribing member universities and organizations within the education community. END __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From sjkleinsr at cox.net Mon Apr 25 09:22:14 2005 From: sjkleinsr at cox.net (Stan Klein, Sr.) Date: Mon Apr 25 09:23:19 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Comments? Message-ID: <20050425132214.LPCY18139.lakermmtao08.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> How many high scoring members of Mensa are in blue collar jobs. Just goes to show that the real needs to do a tough job is guts and determination. Look what Nixon and Carter did for us. Sitting at Falls Creek, PA waiting for a load. Watching the snow fall. > > From: Rich Luchor > > I received this from a liberal GWB hater: > ------------------------------------------ > > The Lovenstein Institute of Scranton Pennsylvania think tank Stan Klein, Sr. Being rich is having money; being wealthy is having time. From sjkleinsr at cox.net Mon Apr 25 09:45:20 2005 From: sjkleinsr at cox.net (Stan Klein, Sr.) Date: Mon Apr 25 09:46:23 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Judge Not Message-ID: <20050425134521.INFF18229.lakermmtao03.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> "JUDGE NOT" ____________ I was shocked, confused, bewildered as I entered Heaven's door, Not by the beauty of it all, by the lights or its decor. It was the folks in Heaven who made me sputter and gasp-- the thieves, the liars, the sinners, the alcoholics, the trash. There stood the kid from seventh grade who swiped my lunch money twice. Next to him was my old neighbor who never said anything nice. Herb, who I always thought was rotting away in hell, was sitting pretty on cloud nine, looking incredibly well. I nudged Jesus, "What's the deal? I would love to hear Your take. How'd all these sinners get up here? God must've made a mistake. And why's everyone so quiet, so somber? Give me a clue." "Hush, child," said He. "They're all in shock... No one thought they'd see you." =============================== Stan Klein, Sr. Being rich is having money; being wealthy is having time. From rluchor at yahoo.com Mon Apr 25 10:31:39 2005 From: rluchor at yahoo.com (Rich Luchor) Date: Mon Apr 25 10:33:46 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Nigerian Scammers Message-ID: <20050425143139.75878.qmail@web31511.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I don't know how many of you get scam emails from Nigeria, I've averaged about 5-6 per month for a couple of years now. It got quiet for awhile but they're back now with a vengence. The link below takes you to one man's attempt to scam the scammers. The "Sister Lillian and the Convent of Blood" correspondence, although a bit long, is hilarious. http://www.dumbentia.com/gallery_scammers.html __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From mriddle at papillion.ne.us Mon Apr 25 10:54:35 2005 From: mriddle at papillion.ne.us (Mike Riddle) Date: Mon Apr 25 10:58:49 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd:Lawyer on Vacation : Professional Courtesy? Message-ID: <20050425145435.KLXO18229.lakermmtao03.cox.net@enigmaster> For all, but especially dep, who has a special fondness in his heart for members of the legal profession. ;-) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: image/jpeg Size: 16502 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.jtan.com/pipermail/os2-right-stuff-l/attachments/20050425/4d5e3a90/attachment-0001.jpg From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Mon Apr 25 13:21:30 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Mon Apr 25 13:23:25 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Comments? In-Reply-To: <20050425122409.69428.qmail@web31514.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20050425122409.69428.qmail@web31514.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <426D271A.7000100@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Rich Luchor wrote: > I received this from a liberal GWB hater: > ------------------------------------------ > > The Lovenstein Institute of Scranton Pennsylvania think tank includes high > caliber historians, psychiatrists, sociologists, scientists in human behavior, > and psychologists. An old hoax. -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From mriddle at papillion.ne.us Mon Apr 25 15:28:35 2005 From: mriddle at papillion.ne.us (Mike Riddle) Date: Mon Apr 25 15:29:21 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Darth Vader's Blog Message-ID: <20050425192835.USMB26223.lakermmtao02.cox.net@enigmaster> ==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== You wondered what was really going on with Darth, didn't you? http://darthside.blogspot.com/ ===================END FORWARDED MESSAGE=================== From dep at drippingwithirony.com Mon Apr 25 19:00:37 2005 From: dep at drippingwithirony.com (dennis e. powell) Date: Mon Apr 25 18:56:32 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] re. Nigerian Scammers Message-ID: <200504251900.37801.dep@drippingwithirony.com> this was my favorite . . . ---------- Forwarded Message ---------- Subject: MUTUAL BENEFIT Date: Friday 23 August 1996 05:46 am From: "Mr Kojo Annen" To: Mr Kojo Annen PLEASE ENDEAVOUR TO USE IT FOR THE CHILDREN OF GOD. I am the above named person from United Nations. I am associate of Mr Benon Savan who worked with United Nations embassy in Oil-for-Food for nine years. We were associated for eleven years. He got much money after a brief negotiation that lasted for only four days. Before his negotiation we were both born again Christians.Since his negotiation I decided not to re-associate or traffic in child outside my matrimonial home which the Bible is against When my former associate was not on the lam he deposited the sum of$5.6Million (Five Million six hundred thousand U.S. Dollars) with one Pinnacle finance/security company insouth africa. Presently, this money is still with the Security Company. Recently, my lawyer told me that I would not last for the next three months due to problem. . . . I will give you oil and food if you help me. Yours in Christ, Mr Kojo Annen ------------------------------------------------------- -- dep Liberalism has been degraded into liberality. Men have tried to turn "revolutionise" from a transitive to an intransitive verb. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From gsjenkins at longview.net Tue Apr 26 06:50:56 2005 From: gsjenkins at longview.net (Stewart Jenkins) Date: Tue Apr 26 08:13:41 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] I don't get it. In-Reply-To: <426AEC70.10209@bernstein.providence.ri.us> References: <200504240037.j3O0bPSh020726@oasis.novia.net> <426AEC70.10209@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <200504260550.56831.gsjenkins@longview.net> On Saturday 23 April 2005 07:46 pm, Bob Bernstein wrote: > Mike Riddle wrote: > >>>Perhaps by virtue of adding a digital sig? > > > > Yup. > > Ok! Bob, this may not mean anything, but your Thunderbird return address has a warning that your signature is bad, but your mutt return address just says the validity of the signature cannot be verified. Probably because I am not online at the moment and I can't hit a public key server. This is in KMail. I actually like seeing the signed messages. But I am a paranoid gun toting vitriolic SOB that hasn't read an email message since the last week of March. Until now... Key ID: 0xCBA173139FC0CB5A for Thunderbird and 0x665FC152F36A68C3 for Mutt. -- Stewart... They took the fourth amendment and I was quiet because I didn't deal drugs When they took the sixth amendment, I was quiet because I was innocent. When they took the second amendment, I was quiet because I didn't own a gun Now they've taken the first amendment, and I can say nothing about it. From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Tue Apr 26 15:34:07 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Tue Apr 26 15:35:55 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] I don't get it. In-Reply-To: <200504260550.56831.gsjenkins@longview.net> References: <200504240037.j3O0bPSh020726@oasis.novia.net> <426AEC70.10209@bernstein.providence.ri.us> <200504260550.56831.gsjenkins@longview.net> Message-ID: <426E97AF.3080504@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Stewart Jenkins wrote: > Bob, this may not mean anything, but your Thunderbird return address has a > warning that your signature is bad, but your mutt return address just says > the validity of the signature cannot be verified. What that means is that I am a poor addled thing who ought to be put away and signed up for Meals On Wheels deliveries. I use t-bird for several accounts, and I can't keep them all straight all of the time in my poor addled brain. So from time to time I will gpg sign a message whose return address is not represented in the key I use for signing said message. That I believe is the source of the 'bad signature' message. As for the 'cannot be verified' complaint, I'm not sure that would be remedied by putting the public key in question on a public key server. Some of my keys are on pgp.mit.edu, and some are not. Guess what? My poor addled brain cannot at any given point in time always recall correctly which keys are on the server, and which are not. Surprise, surprise! I suspect, but am not really at all sure, that the 'verified' business has to do with 'trust level.' I dunno me. -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From prather.js at verizon.net Tue Apr 26 19:09:43 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Tue Apr 26 19:12:58 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Please help....I'm confused! Message-ID: <0IFK00MY1TO7IH3J@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> We have this massive fight going on about filibustering judicial nominees. Yet, I have yet to see any Senators in the chambers at 2 AM. What am I missing? Are these filibusters occurring in the committees, preventing the nominees from coming to the floor? Are the filibusters merely a threat about what will happen on the Senate floor? If so, why all this flailing about mere threats? Is there such a thing as a filibuster in Committee? I've never heard of it. If there is such a thing, why isn't the Judiciary Committee in constant session? My attitude? I think that the nominations should go to the floor, and if the Democrats want to filibuster, then let Teddy take and hold the floor till he dies. Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From dep at linuxandmain.com Tue Apr 26 19:33:37 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Tue Apr 26 19:29:57 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Please help....I'm confused! In-Reply-To: <0IFK00MY1TO7IH3J@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0IFK00MY1TO7IH3J@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <200504261933.37317.dep@linuxandmain.com> quoth Jerry Prather: | We have this massive fight going on about filibustering judicial | nominees. Yet, I have yet to see any Senators in the chambers | at 2 AM. What am I missing? they're a threat. and the senator from tennessee lacks the cojones to hold them to their word -- apparently, to a person our senators are spineless wooses (i would use many much stronger words, but i want at least occasionally to respect the spirit of the rules kari put in place last millennium). | My attitude? I think that the nominations should go to the | floor, and if the Democrats want to filibuster, then let Teddy | take and hold the floor till he dies. problem with that is that under current epa rules, teddy's body would have to be put in a specially prepared containment in a mountain in nevada. by the way -- i have discovered that even worse than removing wallpaper is retaping and sanding drywall, especially in an occupied home. -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From prather.js at verizon.net Tue Apr 26 19:35:30 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Tue Apr 26 19:37:06 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Please help....I'm confused! In-Reply-To: <200504261933.37317.dep@linuxandmain.com> Message-ID: <0IFK00GDOUV7V1V4@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> On Tue, 26 Apr 2005 19:33:37 -0400, dep wrote: >by the way -- i have discovered that even worse than removing wallpaper >is retaping and sanding drywall, especially in an occupied home. Hey! THAT I understand. Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From prather.js at verizon.net Tue Apr 26 19:37:15 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Tue Apr 26 19:38:53 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Please help....I'm confused! In-Reply-To: <200504261933.37317.dep@linuxandmain.com> Message-ID: <0IFK00GL5UY3UUY4@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> On Tue, 26 Apr 2005 19:33:37 -0400, dep wrote: >problem with that is that under current epa rules, teddy's body would >have to be put in a specially prepared containment in a mountain in >nevada. So it's really Teddy that's the nuclear option...ah, so! Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From MSPRATH at aol.com Tue Apr 26 22:58:12 2005 From: MSPRATH at aol.com (MSPRATH@aol.com) Date: Tue Apr 26 23:02:13 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Please help....I'm confused! Message-ID: <1a9.36d5977a.2fa059c4@aol.com> I'm with you. I don't support the "nuclear option" because we haven't had a real filibuster. Let's let them hold up any real work for a real long time (not the fake weekend they did last summer). Then we can see who makes the people mad for holding up the business of government. Mike In a message dated 4/26/2005 1:32:20 P.M. Hawaiian Standard Time, dep@linuxandmain.com writes: quoth Jerry Prather: | We have this massive fight going on about filibustering judicial | nominees. Yet, I have yet to see any Senators in the chambers | at 2 AM. What am I missing? they're a threat. and the senator from tennessee lacks the cojones to hold them to their word -- apparently, to a person our senators are spineless wooses (i would use many much stronger words, but i want at least occasionally to respect the spirit of the rules kari put in place last millennium). | My attitude? I think that the nominations should go to the | floor, and if the Democrats want to filibuster, then let Teddy | take and hold the floor till he dies. problem with that is that under current epa rules, teddy's body would have to be put in a specially prepared containment in a mountain in nevada. by the way -- i have discovered that even worse than removing wallpaper is retaping and sanding drywall, especially in an occupied home. -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" _______________________________________________ os2-right-stuff-l mailing list os2-right-stuff-l@jtan.com http://mailman.jtan.com/mailman/listinfo/os2-right-stuff-l From dep at linuxandmain.com Wed Apr 27 06:03:31 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Wed Apr 27 05:59:13 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Please help....I'm confused! In-Reply-To: <1a9.36d5977a.2fa059c4@aol.com> References: <1a9.36d5977a.2fa059c4@aol.com> Message-ID: <200504270603.31596.dep@linuxandmain.com> quoth MSPRATH@aol.com: | I'm with you. I don't support the "nuclear option" because we | haven't had a real filibuster. Let's let them hold up any real work | for a real long time (not the fake weekend they did last summer). | Then we can see who makes the people mad for holding up the business | of government. | | Mike unfortunately, we're in the middle of yet another attempt to confound the will of the electorate, not unlike that in 1995. you remember how gingrich got vilified -- this time it's tom delay. the delay that should be discussed, though, is the artificial one that the democrats have thrown up -- they don't recognize that they are the minority, and the republicans don't recognize that they are the majority. the last election taught us that the msm have lost their clout, so we can do the right thing with impunity. much of the problem is that frist is a terrible majority leader. we ought to be pointing out to the democrats that if they want to see *any* federal projects in their states, any at all, they will go along with the program. we were victims of this for 50 years, so we ought to be familiar with the idea. but we're doing none of that. unhappily, in the senate one is a lawyer first, then a senator, and only then someone who was elected because of a particular political ideology. -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From sjkleinsr at cox.net Thu Apr 28 16:28:26 2005 From: sjkleinsr at cox.net (Stan Klein, Sr.) Date: Thu Apr 28 16:29:54 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Three Ducks Message-ID: <20050428202827.SQIQ749.lakermmtao06.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> A man walked into a quiet bar. He carried three ducks, one in each hand and one under his left arm. He placed them one beside the other upon the bar. He had a few drinks and chatted with the ducks, and with the bartender. The bartender was surprised, but experienced enough to have learned not to ask people about animals they bring into the bar, so he didn't mention the ducks. They chatted for about another 30 minutes before the man with the ducks had to go to the restroom. He left the ducks there on the bar. The bartender was alone with the ducks. There was an awkward silence as they all looked at one another. The bartender decided to break the ice and try to make a little conversation. "Say, what's your name?" he asked the first duck. "Huey," replied the first duck. "How's your day been, Huey?" "Great. Lovely day. Had a ball. Been in and out of puddles all day! What else could a duck want?" said the duck. "Oh. That's nice," said the bartender. Then he said to the second duck, "Hi. And what's your name?" "Dewey," came the answer from duck number two.> "So how's your day been, Dewey?", he asked. "Great. Lovely day. I've had a ball too! Been in and out of puddles all day myself. If I had the chance on another day I'd do the same again" said the duck in reply. So the bartender turned to the third duck and said, "So, you must be Louie?" "No," SHE said, "my name is Puddles, and don't even ask what kind of day I've had.". Stan Klein, Sr. Being rich is having money; being wealthy is having time. From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Thu Apr 28 16:35:41 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Thu Apr 28 16:39:55 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] "Counterproductive" Message-ID: <4271491D.4010609@bernstein.providence.ri.us> (Nice summary from the WSJ editorial page:) The Wall Street Journal Who's Afraid of John Bolton? April 28, 2005 Maybe we should be grateful to Richard Lugar after all. Now that the Chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee has given his colleagues three more weeks to figure out whether John Bolton wagged a left or a right forefinger at some aggrieved minion, the rest of us can sort through just what the charges against the U.N. nominee are, who is making them, and what the Stop Bolton campaign is really about. That isn't as easy as it seems, for the case against Mr. Bolton keeps morphing to suit the convenience of the accusers. Early on, the charge was that he holds unacceptable views about the U.N. "It's hard for me to know why you'd want to work at an institution that you said didn't even exist," Senator Barbara Boxer told the nominee. Yet her Democratic colleague Chris Dodd insists he does not oppose Mr. Bolton based on his "substantive views," and that "in fact, I agree with some of Mr. Bolton's conclusions about the United Nations." Next we heard the nominee's problem was his temper. "You have a habit of belittling your opposition and even some of your friends," said ranking Committee Democrat Joseph Biden at the opening hearing, whereupon his investigators dredged up every alleged instance in which the nominee lost his cool. Yet on Sunday, Mr. Biden told an interviewer that the issue was "not whether [Mr. Bolton's] a nice guy or not." The latest line on Mr. Bolton is that he's unfit because he may have sought the removal of two intelligence analysts he deemed incompetent and insubordinate. Mr. Bolton says he merely sought their transfer. But even if he had tried to get them fired, so what? A main conclusion of the recent Robb-Silberman report is that policy makers have a duty to question and challenge intelligence analysts. We recall the time Mr. Biden publicly berated an intelligence analyst -- Iraq weapons inspector Scott Ritter -- for taking issue with his civilian bosses. Senior Administration officials, Mr. Biden told Mr. Ritter in 1998, "have responsibilities above your pay grade. ... That's why they get paid the big bucks. That's why they get limos and you don't." Such are the reasons -- the patently disingenuous reasons -- given by Mr. Bolton's opponents. The real motives are a combination of ideological animus and bureaucratic score-settling. On the latter, we know Mr. Bolton tangled with State Department officials who were profoundly antagonistic to President Bush's agenda on issues ranging from the ABM Treaty to the International Criminal Court, and that he usually got his way. Now it's payback time. Thus we have Larry Wilkerson, former Secretary of State Colin Powell's chief of staff, telling the press Mr. Bolton "would be an abysmal ambassador." This is the same Larry Wilkerson who last year said, "I don't care whether utopians are Vladimir Lenin on a sealed train to Moscow or Paul Wolfowitz. Utopians I don't like." He has also described his own Administration's policy toward Cuba as "the dumbest policy on the face of the earth." Or consider the unnamed State Department official who recently told Newsweek that in November 2003, British Foreign Secretary Jack Straw had complained personally to Mr. Powell that his Undersecretary was taking too tough a line on Iran's nuclear weapons program. "Get a different view of [the Iranian problem]," Mr. Powell is reported to have told the aide. "Bolton is being too tough." Remember that at the time, Britain, along with France and Germany, had recently negotiated a nuclear-freeze deal with Iran, a deal Iran violated within months. (For the record, Mr. Straw denies Newsweek's report.) And then there is Thomas Hubbard, the former U.S. ambassador to South Korea, who objected to portions of a speech Mr. Bolton delivered in Seoul in which the Undersecretary called North Korea a "hellish nightmare" ruled by a "tyrannical dictator." Mr. Hubbard does not formally oppose Mr. Bolton's nomination, but he has let it be known that he considered the speech "counterproductive" and overly "antagonistic." None of this, however, quite explains the depth of hostility that Mr. Bolton inspires. The deeper explanation is that he set out to explode the consensus views of the foreign-policy establishment -- and succeeded. This was the consensus that held, or holds, that North Korea and Iran can be bribed away from their nuclear ambitions, that democracy in the Arab world was impossible and probably undesirable, that fighting terrorism merely encourages more terrorism, that countries such as Syria pose no significant threat to U.S. national security, that the U.N. alone confers moral legitimacy on a foreign-policy objective, and that support for Israel explains Islamic hostility to the U.S. Above all, in this view, the job of appointed officials such as Mr. Bolton is to reside benignly in their offices at State while the permanent foreign service bureaucracy goes about applying establishment prescriptions. John Bolton would have none of this. For this, he has been smeared by his partisan critics and maligned, often anonymously, by his former colleagues. But he has also been vindicated by events, and by his accomplishments, in the last four years. If this makes Mr. Bolton unconfirmable in the eyes of the Senate, then talented Americans have no place in our government. URL for this article: http://online.wsj.com/article/0,,SB111465825936219235,00.html -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From m.o.davis at gte.net Thu Apr 28 16:40:58 2005 From: m.o.davis at gte.net (Davis Mark) Date: Thu Apr 28 17:43:21 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Kids; You gotta Love them! Message-ID: <8237efbe8b0717cce60efa01253b44e3@gte.net> Forgive me if you've seen this already. Begin forwarded message: > JACK (3) was watching his Mom breast feeding his new baby sister. After > a while > he asked: "Mom why have you got two? Is one for hot and one for cold > milk?" > > MELANIE (5) asked her Granny how old she was. Granny replied she was so > old she > didn't remember any more. Said Melanie, "If you don't remember you must > look in > the back of your panties. Mine say five to six." > > STEVEN (3) hugged and kissed his Mom goodnight. "I love you so much, > that when > you die I'm going to bury you outside my bedroom window." > > BRITTANY (4) had an earache and wanted a painkiller. She tried in vain > to take > the lid off the bottle. Seeing her frustration, her Mom explained it > was > a > childproof cap and she'd have to open it for her. Eyes wide with > wonder, the little girl asked: "How does it know it's me?" > > SUSAN (4) was drinking juice when she got the hiccups. "Please don't > give Me > this juice again," she said, "It makes my teeth cough." > > DANI (4) stepped onto the bathroom scale and asked: "How much do I > cost?" > > ANDREA (4) was singing and humming, filled with the joy of life. Full > of > smiles, > she turned to her dad and said: "I'm so happy I could vomit." > > MARC (4) was engrossed in a young couple who were hugging and kissing > in > a > restaurant. Without taking his eyes off them, he asked his dad: "Why is > he > whispering in her mouth?" > > CLINTON (5) was in his bedroom looking worried. When his Mom asked what > was > troubling him, he replied, "I don't know what'll happen with this bed > when I get > married. How will my wife fit in?" > > JAMES (4) was listening to a Bible story. His dad read: "The man named > Lot was > warned to take his wife and flee out of the city but his wife looked > back and > was turned to salt." Concerned, James asked: "What happened to the > flea?" > > TAMMY (4) was with her mother when they met an elderly, rather wrinkled > woman > her Mom knew. Tammy looked at her for a while and then asked, "Why > doesn't your > skin fit your face?" -- Mark Davis San Angelo, TX From prather.js at verizon.net Thu Apr 28 16:57:16 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Thu Apr 28 17:59:32 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] "Counterproductive" In-Reply-To: <4271491D.4010609@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <0IFO0089FCVGUYA0@vms048.mailsrvcs.net> On Thu, 28 Apr 2005 16:35:41 -0400, Bob Bernstein wrote: >If this makes Mr. Bolton >unconfirmable in the eyes of the Senate, then talented Americans have no >place in our government. ...and certainly not in Foggy Bottom (as the DoS is sometimes known). BTW: There's an article in the current "Military History" magazine on MacNamara messing up a perfectly practical program during the Vietnam War because of a letter from one of his buddies. (It doesn't seem to be on their web site yet.) Cheers/2, Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From sjkleinsr at cox.net Thu Apr 28 19:46:40 2005 From: sjkleinsr at cox.net (Stan Klein, Sr.) Date: Thu Apr 28 20:03:41 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: Kids; You gotta Love them! Message-ID: <20050428234640.VLBM749.lakermmtao06.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> Those were really cute, Mark. First time I had seen those particular quotes. Mark Davis wrote: >Forgive me if you've seen this already. Stan Klein, Sr. Being rich is having money; being wealthy is having time. From dep at linuxandmain.com Fri Apr 29 00:08:21 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Fri Apr 29 00:08:43 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] bolton Message-ID: <200504290008.21311.dep@linuxandmain.com> my friend wally baran put it very well in a note this evening: Republicans want John Bolton confirmed because he's a tough guy who thinks the U.N. is a collection of corrupt tyrants and freeloading bureaucrats, in serious need of a shake-up. Democrats want John Bolton rejected because he's a tough guy who thinks the U.N. is a collection of corrupt tyrants and freeloading bureaucrats, in serious need of a shake-up. -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From daniel.lee.kruse at gmail.com Fri Apr 29 00:14:52 2005 From: daniel.lee.kruse at gmail.com (Daniel Kruse) Date: Fri Apr 29 00:15:40 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] bolton In-Reply-To: <200504290008.21311.dep@linuxandmain.com> References: <200504290008.21311.dep@linuxandmain.com> Message-ID: <46d72e0005042821143523e91@mail.gmail.com> And that completely hits the nail on the head. Daniel Lee Kruse On 4/28/05, dep wrote: > my friend wally baran put it very well in a note this evening: > > Republicans want John Bolton confirmed because he's a tough guy who > thinks the U.N. is a collection of corrupt tyrants and freeloading > bureaucrats, in serious need of a shake-up. > > Democrats want John Bolton rejected because he's a tough guy who thinks > the U.N. is a collection of corrupt tyrants and freeloading > bureaucrats, in serious need of a shake-up. > > -- > dep > > The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists > have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. > -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" > _______________________________________________ > os2-right-stuff-l mailing list > os2-right-stuff-l@jtan.com > http://mailman.jtan.com/mailman/listinfo/os2-right-stuff-l > From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Fri Apr 29 00:36:44 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Fri Apr 29 00:37:48 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] bolton In-Reply-To: <46d72e0005042821143523e91@mail.gmail.com> References: <200504290008.21311.dep@linuxandmain.com> <46d72e0005042821143523e91@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4271B9DC.5020902@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Daniel Kruse wrote: > And that completely hits the nail on the head. And yet the old familiar drumbeat is starting up: "Let's not go to the mat with [fill in the name of the current sacrificial presidential nominee]." "We have bigger fish to fry." "It's too early to burn the bridges we haven't reached yet." I mean, what's the deal down there? Delay has got all the testosterone, leaving none for anyone else? (That _can't_ be a good thing...) Last week I called Chafee's Washington office, waited until a humanoid answered, identified myself (name, address, etc.) as that rarest of species, a Rhode Island registered Republican voter, and told her (the humanoid) that as far as I was concerned, the Bolton vote in committee was a litmus test for Chafee, and that if he didn't come across with it I would vote for ANY democrat who opposes him next year for reelection. Imagine, now, my embarassment! -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From mriddle at monarch.papillion.ne.us Fri Apr 29 12:54:30 2005 From: mriddle at monarch.papillion.ne.us (Mike Riddle) Date: Fri Apr 29 12:56:00 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: FRIDAY HUMOR - OSAMA AT THE PEARLY GATES Message-ID: <20050429165430.BAMD7787.lakermmtao10.cox.net@enigmaster> Oldie but goodie. ==================BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE================== **_Osama Goes to Heaven_** When Osama bin Laden died, he was met at the Pearly Gates by George Washington, who slapped him across the face and yelled, "How dare you try to destroy the nation I helped conceive!" Patrick Henry approached, punched him in the nose and shouted, "You wanted to end our liberties but you failed." James Madison followed, kicked him and said, "This is why I allowed our government to provide for the common defense!" Thomas Jefferson was next, beat Osama with a long cane and snarled, "It was evil men like you who inspired me to write the Declaration of Independence." The beatings and thrashings continued as George Mason, James Monroe and 66 other early Americans unleashed their anger on the terrorist leader. As Osama lay bleeding and in pain, an Angel appeared. Bin Laden wept and said, "This is not what you promised me." The Angel replied, "I told you there would be 72 Virginians waiting for you in Heaven. What did you think I said?" I thought the Virginia contingent would appreciate this one! ===================END FORWARDED MESSAGE=================== From prather.js at verizon.net Fri Apr 29 13:39:09 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Fri Apr 29 13:40:56 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Fwd: FRIDAY HUMOR - OSAMA AT THE PEARLY GATES In-Reply-To: <20050429165430.BAMD7787.lakermmtao10.cox.net@enigmaster> Message-ID: <0IFP003SOYDAXIT2@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> On Fri, 29 Apr 2005 11:54:30 -0500, Mike Riddle wrote: >I thought the Virginia contingent would appreciate this one! We do. :-) Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Fri Apr 29 14:29:10 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Fri Apr 29 14:30:22 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] bolton In-Reply-To: <4271B9DC.5020902@bernstein.providence.ri.us> References: <200504290008.21311.dep@linuxandmain.com> <46d72e0005042821143523e91@mail.gmail.com> <4271B9DC.5020902@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <42727CF6.7040908@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Bob Bernstein wrote: > Last week I called Chafee's Washington office... Imagine, now, my > embarassment! Well, it's clear I have failed to arouse any sympathy around here for my plight. Imagine that WFB had written, instead of "Pity Rhode Island," something like "Pity Virginia," or, "Pity Nebraska!" -=snip=- PITY RHODE ISLAND By William F. Buckley Jr. Tue Apr 12, 7:58 PM ET What is a sophisticated position on the United Nations? As the old saw goes, I'm glad you asked that question. I say that having served in the U.N. as a public member of the U.S. delegation and written a book on the U.N. One feels the special pangs of John Bolton right now, up for ambassador to the U.N. Poor John; he was once derisory at the U.N.'s expense, using very amusing language to bounce off the bureaucratic density of the organization. His barb was to the effect that if you lopped off the top 10 stories of that big building, nothing much would be missed. But -- no jokes in church. And church is what the United Nations is, in solemn quarters. There is even an organization called Citizens for Global Solutions. It has spent $20,000 on ads in Rhode Island urging the citizens of that monolithic state (10 percent GOP) to send disciplinary messages to Sen. Lincoln Chafee (news, bio, voting record), whose vote on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee is critical to the success of Mr. Bolton's candidacy. Without Chafee, the committee is tied, and Bolton can't therefore get pre-emptive consideration in the Senate, where he would be passed. What we are seeing is a tug-of-war involving not President Bush's authority to send his own man to the United Nations, but rather the re-election, in 2006, of a senator in Rhode Island. Chafee is a Republican. If he feels bound to stay with the GOP, that's because, as he reminded everyone recently, he was named after Abraham Lincoln. So he has not changed party affiliation, but his voting record would fit nicely within the bounds of Democratic orthodoxy. At the last national election, he said that he would not willingly vote for Bush, but would vote for Bush's father, who, however, wasn't running. The president is looking for a strong man at the United Nations, and here is the problem. The strength of the organization depends heavily on the strength within it of the United States. To the extent that the U.N. goes its own way, you get such as the Commission on Human Rights, which has in recent years been headed up by Tunisia and Libya, and includes such human rights devotes as Sudan, Zimbabwe, China, Cuba and Saudi Arabia. That kind of thing may appeal to the Citizens for Global Solutions, but it doesn't really do very much for the United Nations, except to remind us how many stories of it the next hurricane could whisk away without hurting anybody. The United Nations' duties fall roughly under two dispensations. The first has to do with clerical concerns. How do you divide up the airwaves? What are the obligations of nation-states to other nation-states? The second category has to do with policy. Here the powerful nations have to exercise the dominant voice. It is in anticipation of this, of course, that the Security Council was devised, giving permanent positions to the five major world powers. For 45 years, in fact, there were two contending powers, not five: the United States and the Soviet Union. Now there is a single power -- the superpower. On critical matters, it has to prevail. To the extent it does not do so, the United Nations becomes marginal. Bright and reasonable people know this, and it was because of this that the choice of John Bolton, coming in from undersecretary of state for arms control and international security, was so very much welcome. He told the Foreign Relations Committee that he recognizes that ambassador to the U.N. is not an independent policy-making role. The ambassador, he shrugged, even gives speeches that are actually written in Washington. Bolton is perfectly prepared to play in New York the role of surrogate for President Bush. He gave the committee no reason to doubt that he would proceed as a civil servant, operating at the pleasure of the president of the United States, who, as Sen. Chafee reluctantly acknowledged, was voted into that office athwart the will of the majority of people who live in Rhode Island. That said, Mr. Bolton is in the tradition of singular people who, while serving their presidents faithfully, nevertheless leave their personal stamp on their ambassadorships. Jeane Kirkpatrick was a mountainous moral presence in the United Nations, while Daniel Patrick Moynihan reminded us that Socrates still lives, even if he couldn't predictably win a Senate seat in Rhode Island. It would be a sign of great democratic health if one or two Democrats on the committee were to vote to confirm Bolton, but meanwhile, all rests on Lincoln Chafee, who was named after Abraham Lincoln. -=snip=- http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=128&e=5&u=/ucwb/20050412/cm_ucwb/pityrhodeisland -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From prather.js at verizon.net Fri Apr 29 15:09:20 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Fri Apr 29 15:11:00 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] bolton In-Reply-To: <42727CF6.7040908@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <0IFQ0031C2JKAYDE@vms040.mailsrvcs.net> On Fri, 29 Apr 2005 14:29:10 -0400, Bob Bernstein wrote: >Well, it's clear I have failed to arouse any sympathy around here for my >plight. Imagine that WFB had written, instead of "Pity Rhode Island," >something like "Pity Virginia," or, "Pity Nebraska!" Virginians and Nebraskans don't have anything to feel Blue about... Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Fri Apr 29 15:29:29 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Fri Apr 29 15:29:54 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] bolton In-Reply-To: <0IFQ0031C2JKAYDE@vms040.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0IFQ0031C2JKAYDE@vms040.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <42728B19.6010407@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Jerry Prather wrote: > Virginians and Nebraskans don't have anything to feel Blue > about... Hmph. Figures, coming from someone like yourself, whose feelings towards Rhode Island are WELL KNOWN! -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From daniel.lee.kruse at gmail.com Sat Apr 30 02:12:33 2005 From: daniel.lee.kruse at gmail.com (Daniel Kruse) Date: Sat Apr 30 02:14:28 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] bolton In-Reply-To: <4271B9DC.5020902@bernstein.providence.ri.us> References: <200504290008.21311.dep@linuxandmain.com> <46d72e0005042821143523e91@mail.gmail.com> <4271B9DC.5020902@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <46d72e00050429231246564e69@mail.gmail.com> On 4/28/05, Bob Bernstein wrote: > Daniel Kruse wrote: > > > I mean, what's the deal down there? Delay has got all the testosterone, > leaving none for anyone else? (That _can't_ be a good thing...) So true. > > Last week I called Chafee's Washington office, waited until a humanoid > answered, identified myself (name, address, etc.) as that rarest of > species, a Rhode Island registered Republican voter, and told her (the > humanoid) that as far as I was concerned, the Bolton vote in committee > was a litmus test for Chafee, and that if he didn't come across with it > I would vote for ANY democrat who opposes him next year for reelection. > Imagine, now, my embarassment! Not saying the Republican party is any better, but would it be wise giving power back to the Clinton, Shumers, Kenedys, et al? From what Chafee sounds like though he is Democrat in stance and Republican in name only. > > -- > Bob Bernstein I'm so sick of Republicans and Democrats that next time I vote it'll be some third party. Not that a third (or fourth) party can get in but just as a protest vote. The way the Republicrats /Demopublicans (take your pick) have things jury-rigged it will be very hard to get an other-party candidate into office. But like I wrote - a protest vote. Daniel Lee Kruse From dep at linuxandmain.com Sat Apr 30 06:51:57 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Sat Apr 30 06:46:50 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] bolton In-Reply-To: <46d72e00050429231246564e69@mail.gmail.com> References: <200504290008.21311.dep@linuxandmain.com> <4271B9DC.5020902@bernstein.providence.ri.us> <46d72e00050429231246564e69@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200504300651.57323.dep@linuxandmain.com> quoth Daniel Kruse: | Not saying the Republican party is any better, but would it be wise | giving power back to the Clinton, Shumers, Kenedys, et al? From what | Chafee sounds like though he is Democrat in stance and Republican in | name only. on paper, the republican party is much better. unfortunately, it is saddled with a class of persons called "legislators," and their motto is "where are my goodies?" this was the whole point of term limits, the re-establishment of the citizen legislator and the elimination of the professional legislator. that having been said, a rino is better than a democrat for this reason: even if you're a bad republican, your presence counts in making the majority. | I'm so sick of Republicans and Democrats that next time I vote it'll | be some third party. Not that a third (or fourth) party can get in | but just as a protest vote. The way the Republicrats /Demopublicans | (take your pick) have things jury-rigged it will be very hard to get | an other-party candidate into office. But like I wrote - a protest | vote. two observations on that. the first was alluded to by garrison keillor last saturday, in a story in which out of protest the school play was canceled. they thought that everyone would be riled up by this, but the response was, "oh." quitting something out of the principle that it is something of which one does not care to be a part is all well and good and sometimes even an imperative. quitting something out of the belief that it will demonstrate to others the error of the situation seldom has much effect. and, two, where it does have an effect, it is often not the one desired. many people in protest voted for ross perot, and we got bill clinton as a result. republicans in connecticut decided to run the rino lowell weicker out of office -- and he became governor as an independent and pushed through the state's first (and now utterly established, and high) income tax. -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From mriddle at oasis.novia.net Sat Apr 30 07:41:39 2005 From: mriddle at oasis.novia.net (Mike Riddle) Date: Sat Apr 30 07:42:14 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] bolton In-Reply-To: <200504300651.57323.dep@linuxandmain.com> Message-ID: <200504301141.j3UBfdqu001885@oasis.novia.net> On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 06:51:57 -0400, dep wrote: >this was the whole point of term limits, the >re-establishment of the citizen legislator and the elimination of the >professional legislator. Which is why the Senate "Ethics" Committee is telling Dr. Coburn he has to give up his Ob-Gyn practice? From rluchor at yahoo.com Sat Apr 30 08:57:22 2005 From: rluchor at yahoo.com (Rich Luchor) Date: Sat Apr 30 08:58:18 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] bolton In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050430125722.78716.qmail@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> --- dep wrote: > and, two, where it does have an effect, it is often not the one desired. > many people in protest voted for ross perot, and we got bill clinton as > a result. republicans in connecticut decided to run the rino lowell > weicker out of office -- and he became governor as an independent and > pushed through the state's first (and now utterly established, and > high) income tax. > -- Weicker was elected because he ran on a 'no state income tax' platform and all the while he had his people studying other states tax methods. I had to pay both Connecticut and Maine income taxes this year but that's all behind me now. Rich __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From dep at linuxandmain.com Sat Apr 30 09:28:27 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Sat Apr 30 09:30:16 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] bolton In-Reply-To: <20050430125722.78716.qmail@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20050430125722.78716.qmail@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200504300928.27536.dep@linuxandmain.com> quoth Rich Luchor: | Weicker was elected because he ran on a 'no state income tax' | platform and all the while he had his people studying other states | tax methods. I had to pay both Connecticut and Maine income taxes | this year but that's all behind me now. i'm constantly reminded that my impression of connecticut was erroneous and how one of the best views i ever had of it (though i did not think so at the time) was how it looked in the rearview mirror. -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From prather.js at verizon.net Sat Apr 30 09:37:12 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Sat Apr 30 09:38:19 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] bolton In-Reply-To: <200504300928.27536.dep@linuxandmain.com> Message-ID: <0IFR00C96HU1O4L4@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 09:28:27 -0400, dep wrote: >i'm constantly reminded that my impression of connecticut was erroneous >and how one of the best views i ever had of it (though i did not think >so at the time) was how it looked in the rearview mirror. Things change over time. I loved living in San Diego in 1972-1975. Going back to San Diego for both business and pleasure over the years has caused my opinion of the place to go downhill. Things like smog, for instance. Back in the Seventies, there wasn't any in San Diego. There sure is a lot of smog now. Traffic is much worse. You can't go home again -- I think someone said that before! Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Sat Apr 30 15:44:42 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Sat Apr 30 15:45:46 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] bolton In-Reply-To: <200504300651.57323.dep@linuxandmain.com> References: <200504290008.21311.dep@linuxandmain.com> <4271B9DC.5020902@bernstein.providence.ri.us> <46d72e00050429231246564e69@mail.gmail.com> <200504300651.57323.dep@linuxandmain.com> Message-ID: <4273E02A.10401@bernstein.providence.ri.us> dep wrote: > that having been said, a rino is better than a democrat for this reason: > even if you're a bad republican, your presence counts in making the > majority. File most of this thread under: Casuistical Overkill What I tell a Senate office staffer in the heat of an angry phone call is one thing. What I do in the blessed privacy of my polling booth may be quite another. The aim of the phone call was to make an emotional communication to the Chafee gang, to make someone down there, if only for a few seconds, *UNCOMFORTABLE*. Chafee is well hated by a mixed spectrum of RI voters, but of course gets a free pass from most of the state's Democrats; I actually believe the fru-fru granola Brown University (think: "Josh Marshall") crowd *prefers* a rino who carries the still-potent Chafee moniker to one of their own, more or less sleazy, run-of-the-mill Democratic machine hacks. -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From dep at linuxandmain.com Sat Apr 30 16:05:49 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Sat Apr 30 16:01:21 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] bolton In-Reply-To: <4273E02A.10401@bernstein.providence.ri.us> References: <200504290008.21311.dep@linuxandmain.com> <200504300651.57323.dep@linuxandmain.com> <4273E02A.10401@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <200504301605.49921.dep@linuxandmain.com> quoth Bob Bernstein: | The aim of the phone call was to make an emotional communication to | the Chafee gang, to make someone down there, if only for a few | seconds, *UNCOMFORTABLE*. well, there we go then. i thought it was about governance, but it was about venting. my mistake. -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us Sat Apr 30 18:01:58 2005 From: rs at bernstein.providence.ri.us (Bob Bernstein) Date: Sat Apr 30 18:02:23 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] New Godel book Message-ID: <42740056.5060106@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Nice book review in the Times: http://www.nytimes.com/2005/05/01/books/review/01SCHULMA.html -- Bob Bernstein What is the significance of the fact that "abstractions" and "generalizations" and the very concepts of "time" and "space" occur only in conjunction with a human nervous system? P.W. Bridgman (1955) From prather.js at verizon.net Sat Apr 30 19:13:16 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Sat Apr 30 19:14:31 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] New Godel book In-Reply-To: <42740056.5060106@bernstein.providence.ri.us> Message-ID: <0IFS008KI8I4V185@vms048.mailsrvcs.net> On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 18:01:58 -0400, Bob Bernstein wrote: >Nice book review in the Times: > >http://www.nytimes.com/2005/05/01/books/review/01SCHULMA.html Very interesting view of a complex subject. A parallel question: Is there intelligent life in Rhode Island? (Excepting Bob, of course.) Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From spmaiorca at cox.net Sat Apr 30 19:50:04 2005 From: spmaiorca at cox.net (S.P Maiorca) Date: Sat Apr 30 19:52:26 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] Christos Vokrese!!!! Message-ID: <427419AC.3040407@cox.net> hey Sinla if your here Christos Vokrese!!!! From spmaiorca at cox.net Sat Apr 30 20:12:29 2005 From: spmaiorca at cox.net (S.P Maiorca) Date: Sat Apr 30 20:14:43 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] (no subject) Message-ID: <42741EED.2080008@cox.net> * * *THE SERBIAN ORTHODOX CHURCH TO HER SPIRITUAL CHILDREN AT PASCHA, 2005* *P A V L E* *By the grace of God* *Orthodox Archbishop of Pec, Metropolitan of Belgrade-Karlovci and Serbian Patriarch, with all the Hierarchs of the Serbian Orthodox Church?to all the clergy, monastics, and all the sons and daughters of our holy Church: grace, mercy and peace from God the Father, and our Lord Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit, with the joyous paschal greeting:* *CHRIST IS RISEN!* /?Christ is risen, shaking the earth,// /Removing sadness and bringing joy?/ /(Holy Bishop Nicholai)// With these words of the Holy Bishop Nicholai we announce the most joyous of all days ? the day when life manifested itself to the world, when death was defeated, when the doors to Hades were destroyed, the all-joyous day the day of Resurrection. The resurrection is the greatest event in our human history, our Divine-human eternity. It is the day, which delivers us out of all the worldly days and nights of this life, and brings us into the day without evening, the eternal day of God?s Kingdom. ?Pascha is the Feast of all feasts and Celebration of all celebrations, which surpasses all other feasts and celebrations just as the sun surpasses the stars? (St. Gregory the Theologian). In the light of the Resurrection we comprehend our entire life and rejoice in it. This day of the Resurrection is a day to rejoice in life and Life Eternal. We must witness to this world and to this time the joy which the Resurrection of Christ brings us today, for this is a Joy which no one else can ever give us, and which cannot be taken away. It is exactly the absence of joy, or rather of meaningful joy, which torments contemporary man. The absence of joy comes from mankind?s lack of understanding that death is not the final end. If death is truly our final end, after which there is nothing, or after which there is only some vague kind of life of the eternal soul, then man?s life is a great tragedy, which begins at birth and with each day only comes closer to its ?final end?. This day of the Resurrection of Christ shows and testifies to us that it is not thus; this is why on this day we, filled with the light of the Resurrection, exclaim together with the Apostle Paul: ?O Death, where is your sting? O Hades, where is your victory?? (I Cor. 15:55). Truly, great and marvelous is the mystery of Christ?s Resurrection and the saving gifts, which the risen Christ brings to the world and to mankind. In order for us to understand this mystery and rejoice at the Resurrection of Christ, we must understand the Biblical, living, divinely revealed truth which bears witness that God created the world out of nothing (Gen. 1:1). Neither the world, nor man, even though he is created in God?s image and likeness as the crown and pearl of all of creation, have anything in and of themselves which would sustain them apart from God (Gen. 1:26; 2,17). This is why life is possible only in communion with God. With Adam?s sin death entered into the world, and thus broke the communion with God (Gen. 3:19). The world that was created for eternity began to suffer and struggle, ?for the wages of sin is death? (Rm. 6:23). Therefore, the repentance of Adam and of all the Old Testament righteous men and women was insufficient, because repentance only ends the life lived in sin, but we needed more: we needed to be delivered out of the state of decay, ruin, disintegration and death (Rom. 8:22-23). As death entered through the body, so it was necessary that life enter through it, so that the body could be cleansed of decay and put on life. ?I had a part in God?s image, and did not retain it; and now He?Christ?partakes in my body to save the image of God within me, and make my body immortal,? says St. Gregory the Theologian. And so with His Incarnation Christ began the work of redemption; but the death of His Life-giving body was also necessary, since it was only through death that Resurrection was made possible (St. Athanasius the Great). The saving power of the death and Resurrection of Christ comes from the fact that He is the God-man, in whose Person are two unmingled, undivided, unchangeable, inseparable natures, fully Divine and fully human (as the Ecumenical Council of Chalcedon confessed). The greatness of Christ?s sacrifice and of His love are reflected precisely in the fact that the human nature which is assumed by the Person of God the Word is without sin, so Christ, being without sin, suffers and dies on the Cross voluntarily, freely, out of His love for mankind. Had He had sin, He would not have been able to die freely, but out of necessity: ?for the wages of sin is death? (Rom. 6:23). With His entrance into Hades, He tramples on death and with His Resurrection He destroys the power of death. After the Resurrection of Christ the reality of temporary death is not eradicated ? man continues to die ? but the Resurrection abolishes the inevitability of death. For, if someone dies in order to have a better life, then this is not death but a brief falling asleep and passage from death to life. The separation of the soul from the body is temporary. The assurance of this is Christ?s Resurrection, according to the words of the Apostle Paul: ?For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all shall be made alive? (I Cor. 15:22). For this reason we refer to Christ, the Crucified and Resurrected, as the New Adam in whom we all shall live (I Cor. 15:45). This is possible since through baptism we have put on Christ, with Him we die and are resurrected, while in the Holy Eucharist ? in the Liturgy ? in Holy Communion, we receive Christ into ourselves and we are taken into Christ for eternal life. In other words: in the Church we have received the gift of adoption and the guarantee of immortality; for this reason we call God ?Father? in the Liturgy since we have been adopted through the Son who alone can call God ?Father?. So from this unity with Christ we grasp that Christ?s victory over death is also our victory over death and the beginning of life eternal. This profound truth was known by all righteous Christian men and women throughout the ages and to the present day. It was known and lived by the Jasenovac martyrs to whom we pray, and whom we especially remember on this 60th anniversary of the breakout of the surviving victims from the notorious death camp. It was only thanks to their faith that the hundreds of thousands of prisoners in Jasenovac ? like St. Vukasin of Klepac ? some of whom suffered as holy martyrs, found the strength to attempt to escape, barehanded, over the barbed wire surrounding the camp, knowing that they would live whether they passed over the wires or whether they remained within them. Thus, our faith in the Resurrection has deep meaning and justification. For this reason we prostrate ourselves before the Cross, venerating it, and crossing ourselves; for we know that the Resurrection comes through the Cross, the foundation of our faith according to the words of the Apostle Paul: ?If Christ is not risen, then our preaching is in vain and your faith is also in vain? (I Cor. 15:14). Our Kosovo today is a symbol of the Cross. However, our crucified brothers and sisters in Kosovo and Metohija, know that the Cross of Christ always leads to the Resurrection (Rom. 8:18). For this reason we firmly believe that the light of Christ?s Resurrection will shine upon our brothers and sisters in Kosovo and Metohija. However, in order that we might feel that light and be made worthy of it in Kosovo and outside of Kosovo, in all the regions of the world, we must make peace with those ? and there are many ? who hate us. For the sake of the Resurrection of Christ we must forgive and make peace; for God ? in whom we believe and whose Resurrection we glorify ? is the God of peace, love and forgiveness. Just as He forgave those who crucified Him on the Cross, so too should we, together with our Crucified and Resurrected Lord, say out of the depths of our souls: ?Forgive them Father for they know not what they do!? (Luke 23:34). But forgive us also, Lord, if we have behaved offensively. We call all of our Christ-loving people to this kind of a faith; once again, this faith is not a faith in death, as some have maliciously asserted. It is faith in eternal life, which begins here and now. For this reason we call upon all people, especially the young, that their lives may be anchored in Christ, in His Divine-human organism which is the Church. It is only in this way and in this place that they will find the peace and joy for which they yearn. We know that youth is the pleasantest but also the stormiest part of human life. Therefore, at no other time in our lives is freedom so subject to temptation. For this reason we call upon our youth not to sacrifice their freedom to the ?murderous slavemasters? of drugs and alcohol, as well as debauched living which endangers the healthy preparation for the sanctity of marriage. Therefore, we call upon our youth to humble themselves before the sanctity and gravity of life, for life is not a party, and cannot be summed up by enjoyment alone. Life is a constant battle against all that which separates us from the Lord. It is one constant battle for ?freedom from sin? and not ?freedom for sin?, which today is called ?emancipation? or so-called ?progress?. The Christian life is a battle for good against evil and against the perversions we see in ourselves, in others, and in the communities to which we belong. We must never forget that evil is of short duration and only appears to shine and be successful. We should, therefore, never base anything, particularly our lives, on evil, wickedness, and falsehoods. Only if the Resurrected Lord is the anchor of our lives will we find the peace and joy for which everyone yearns. When the Apostle Philip told his friend Nathaniel that they had found the Messiah, Nathanial expressed his doubt; but the Apostle Philip called him saying: ?Come and see? (John 1:45-46). We send this invitation to you, our spiritual children: Come and see. Come into our churches; take part in the Divine Liturgy, which is the living image of the future Kingdom of God, for taking part in the Divine Liturgy means to have a foretaste of the fruits of the Heavenly Kingdom here and now. Here we see that our Christian future depends neither on our difficult material conditions, nor on the mighty of this world; what is most important is this: in the Divine Liturgy we see that our life has meaning, that our future has meaning which is not limited only to this world and to this age, but which continues on into eternity. In the name of that meaning and joy, our dear spiritual children, we call down upon you all the all-joyous light and power of the Resurrected God-man, our Lord Jesus Christ. Let us today and every day of our lives rejoice exceedingly, for Christ?s Resurrection has dawned upon us. Rejoice, for death has been conquered! With your joy you bear witness to the joy of the Resurrection to all peoples and all nations, both Christian and non-Christian. Rejoice, for the joy of the Resurrection has been given to us. This joy will flow from us into the entire creation of God, upon which today we call the all-sanctifying power of the Resurrection, so that together with all of creation we may joyfully cry: *CHRIST IS RISEN!** *INDEED HE IS RISEN!** Given at the Serbian Patriarchate in Belgrade, at Pascha, 2005. Your intercessors before the Risen Lord: Archbishop of Pec, Metropolitan of Belgrade-Karlovci and Serbian Patriarch PAVLE Metropolitan of Zagreb and Ljubljana JOVAN Metropolitan of Montenegro and the Coastlands AMPHILOHIJE Metropolitan of Midwestern America CHRISTOPHER Metropolitan of Dabro-Bosna NIKOLAJ Bishop of Sabac-Valjevo LAVRENTIJE Bishop of Nis IRINEJ Bishop of Zvornik-Tuzla VASILIJE Bishop of Srem VASILIJE Bishop of Banja Luka JEFREM Bishop of Budim LUKIJAN Bishop of Canada GEORGIJE Bishop of Banat NIKANOR Bishop for America and Canada (New Gracanica Metropolitanate) LONGIN Bishop of Eastern America MITROPHAN Bishop of Zica CHRYSOSTOM Bishop of Backa IRINEJ Bishop of Great Britain and Scandinavia DOSITEJ Bishop of Ras and Prizren ARTEMIJE Retired Bishop of Zahumlje and Hercegovina ATANASIJE Bishop of Bihac and Petrovac CHRYSOSTOM Bishop of Osijek and Baranja LUKIJAN Bishop of Central Europe CONSTANTINE Bishop of Western Europe LUKA Bishop of Timok JUSTIN Bishop of Vranje PAHOMIJE Bishop of Sumadija JOVAN Bishop of Slavonia SAVA Bishop of Branicevo IGNATIJE Bishop of Milesevo FILARET Bishop of Dalmatia FOTIJE Bishop of Budimlje and Niksic JOANIKIJE Bishop of Zahumlje and Hercegovina GRIGORIJE Bishop of Australia and New Zealand (New Gracanica Metropolitanate) MILUTIN Bishop of Gornji Karlovci GERASIM Vicar Bishop of Hvostno ATANASIJE Vicar Bishop of Jegar PORFIRIJE Vicar Bishop of Lipljan TEODOSIJE Vicar Bishop of Dioclea JOVAN Vicar Bishop of Hum MAKSIM The Orthodox Archdiocese of Ochrid Metropolitan of Veles and Povardara JOVAN, Patriarchal Exarch of the Autonomous Archdiocese of Ohrid Bishop of Polos and Kumanovo JOAKIM Bishop of Dremvic and locum tenens of the Diocese of Bitolj MARKO From dep at linuxandmain.com Sat Apr 30 20:24:29 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Sat Apr 30 20:19:26 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] i just got the best thing in the world Message-ID: <200504302024.29377.dep@linuxandmain.com> no, not that. it's a yellow plastic thing that looks like a toy tennis raquet, only the "strings" are wire and are strung in a parallel fashion only, with no wires perpendicular to them. you put two batteries in the handle. it is a manually operated *bug zapper*! works like the ones you hang up outside, but there's no u.v. light -- you have to swing at 'em. so this summer i'll be able to play many exciting games with our arthropod friends. (i don't know, but in a pinch it might grill a hamburger, too.) supremely cool, imho. -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From sjkleinsr at cox.net Sat Apr 30 20:36:28 2005 From: sjkleinsr at cox.net (Stan Klein, Sr.) Date: Sat Apr 30 20:37:27 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] i just got the best thing in the world Message-ID: <20050501003626.CMGC26223.lakermmtao02.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> Just the thing for a fellow who drives a Honda Element. BTW, what is your impression of the Element now that you have had it for a while Sitting at Seymour, Indiana. Headed to Indianapolis to pick up a load headed for Chesapeake, VA. > > From: dep > Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] i just got the best thing in the world > > no, not that. > Stan Klein, Sr. Being rich is having money; being wealthy is having time. From prather.js at verizon.net Sat Apr 30 21:12:25 2005 From: prather.js at verizon.net (Jerry Prather) Date: Sat Apr 30 21:13:32 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] i just got the best thing in the world In-Reply-To: <20050501003626.CMGC26223.lakermmtao02.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> Message-ID: <0IFS00BC5E0Q2I17@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 20:36:28 -0400, Stan Klein, Sr. wrote: >Sitting at Seymour, Indiana. Headed to Indianapolis to pick up a load headed for Chesapeake, VA. Hey, that's right next door to VA Beach! Jerry -- Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them quills. -Unknown From dep at linuxandmain.com Sat Apr 30 21:20:06 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Sat Apr 30 21:14:25 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] i just got the best thing in the world In-Reply-To: <20050501003626.CMGC26223.lakermmtao02.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> References: <20050501003626.CMGC26223.lakermmtao02.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> Message-ID: <200504302120.06388.dep@linuxandmain.com> quoth Stan Klein, Sr.: | Just the thing for a fellow who drives a Honda Element. yeah! i can hold it out the window and add some birds to the list! | BTW, what is your impression of the Element now that you have had it | for a while love it. just love it. would get another one in an instant -- in fact, there's nothing else that would much interest me. (though at some point i'll probably pick up an $800 pickup just for hauling stuff that i don't want in the element.) -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy" From mriddle at oasis.novia.net Sat Apr 30 21:13:32 2005 From: mriddle at oasis.novia.net (Mike Riddle) Date: Sat Apr 30 21:14:37 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] i just got the best thing in the world In-Reply-To: <20050501003626.CMGC26223.lakermmtao02.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> Message-ID: <200505010113.j411DX1Z009432@oasis.novia.net> On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 20:36:28 -0400, Stan Klein, Sr. wrote: >Just the thing for a fellow who drives a Honda Element. >BTW, what is your impression of the Element now that you have had it for >a while Ah, take a look at #4: Found at http://cartalk.com/content/features/uglycar/ The column in your local fishwrap may have an expanded version. 10. BMW 5 Series "With the granny glasses headlights and awkward body creases, it looks like a Pontiac on acid." 9. Chrysler 300 "Did Chrysler have the head of a cow in mind when designing this car?" 8. Dodge Magnum "The Welsh Corgi of the car world -- wishes to be a big dog, but too short to the ground." 7. Chevy Avalanche "Adorned with more plastic than Anna Nicole Smith." 6. Subaru Baja "Looks more at home in Prague." 5. Chrysler PT Cruiser "So ugly, I get mad just looking at it." 4. Honda Element "A rollover would improve its looks!" 3. Hummer H2 "The automotive equivalent of Aunt Bertha." 2. Toyota Scion xB "Its appearance should serve as an innovative but effective first line of defense against car theft" while another wondered if, "the cleaning lady took the plans out of the trash as a joke -- and nobody noticed." And the #1 Ugliest Car of 2005: The Pontiac Aztek "It looks like it went into the crusher before the showroom!" "It looks the way Montezuma's revenge feel." "Was Pontiac taken over by a high school shop class?" "Looks like it was designed by two separate teams of engineers that started at opposite bumpers and worked their way toward the middle, each unable to talk to the other until they met at the center door post." "Let's face it, not every engineering student gets an 'A'. The 'D' students need work, too." From sjkleinsr at cox.net Sat Apr 30 22:29:44 2005 From: sjkleinsr at cox.net (Stan Klein, Sr.) Date: Sat Apr 30 22:30:37 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] i just got the best thing in the world Message-ID: <20050501022943.KNKT28809.lakermmtao07.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> Assuming that I get to take the load all the way, it delivers on the 2nd at 1130 hours. Anything could happen and I could end up splitting or swapping it to someone else. Shoot me your phone #, maybe we can meet for coffee/tea/sprite. > > From: "Jerry Prather" > Date: 2005/04/30 Sat PM 09:12:25 EDT > To: "os2-right-stuff-l@jtan.com" , > "Stan Klein, Sr." , > "Stan@Klein-Sr.org" > Subject: Re: [os2-right-stuff-l] i just got the best thing in the world > > On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 20:36:28 -0400, Stan Klein, Sr. wrote: > > >Sitting at Seymour, Indiana. Headed to Indianapolis to pick up a load headed for Chesapeake, VA. > > Hey, that's right next door to VA Beach! > > Jerry Stan Klein, Sr. Being rich is having money; being wealthy is having time. From sjkleinsr at cox.net Sat Apr 30 22:31:08 2005 From: sjkleinsr at cox.net (Stan Klein, Sr.) Date: Sat Apr 30 22:32:27 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] i just got the best thing in the world Message-ID: <20050501023106.DGFA749.lakermmtao06.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> You thinking pheasant/quail/partridge? > > From: dep > > yeah! i can hold it out the window and add some birds to the list! Stan Klein, Sr. Being rich is having money; being wealthy is having time. From dep at linuxandmain.com Sat Apr 30 23:02:44 2005 From: dep at linuxandmain.com (dep) Date: Sat Apr 30 22:59:35 2005 Subject: [os2-right-stuff-l] i just got the best thing in the world In-Reply-To: <20050501023106.DGFA749.lakermmtao06.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> References: <20050501023106.DGFA749.lakermmtao06.cox.net@smtp.east.cox.net> Message-ID: <200504302302.44760.dep@linuxandmain.com> quoth Stan Klein, Sr.: | You thinking pheasant/quail/partridge? sparrows. maybe buzzards. -- dep The secularists have not wrecked divine things; but the secularists have wrecked secular things, if that is any comfort to them. -- G.K. Chesterton, "Orthodoxy"